Halloween - an Irish invention and an American export

George: empty abuse is your area of expertise; it certainly isn’t Ireland. You give lip service to things such as Irish lore, yet it was I who actually gave an example of such. There is a great deal more substance in my posts than there is in yours. Because I grew up in Ireland I don’t have to rely on IC articles for my information: the phrase Trick or Treating has been used in Ireland for decades, so your statement regarding its use is wrong (indeed if you are relying on IC to provide you with accurate information on Irish culture, then your ignorance is excusable). It is a bit odd that you fill your post with imagined scenes of me ‘screaming and cursing‘, etc., and then accuse ME of offering nothing but ‘nonsense and inane abuse’. George, it is you who should cease pretending to be an interpreter of modern Irish life; you didn’t grow up here and you don’t live here, as a result you must rely on IC articles to back up your ‘arguments’. You say that you don’t care how I and my family practice Halloween…yeah, well why are you commenting on the ‘Irish Halloween’ when you have no interest in it? Why don’t you surprise me George and reply to my post with manners and perhaps include some of the Irish lore that you so love to talk about…that would be really terrifying!

I paid you no "complement", kinvara, and certainly no compliment. Learn the difference. And learn to argue on the basis of reason and evidence, not on your stupid empty abuse. Did you make one substantive point in any of your postings here? No. But first go read Fay's article above. Note that he too shows up your ignorance when he points out that when he moved to Ireland just some 15/16 years ago, no one said "Trick or Treat". This correctly refutes the nonsense you wrote in an earlier post. The fact is that you, kinvara, like many of the Irish, no longer even have a keen eye for what is going on in Ireland. You spend too much time in the pub getting drunk and screaming and cursing at English soccer games on TV. It takes sharp visitors like myself to chronicle the demise of Irish culture. I don`t care what things you enjoy and practice in your own home, kinvra, but quit the stupid effort to put yourself forward as an interpreter of modern Irish life. You have nothing to offer except nonsense and inane abuse.

No George it comes from Ireland where I live and my experiences of Halloween. What a surprise that you are once again droning on about the ‘modern Irish’. You say that we are ‘cut off from [our] Halloween traditions’, and that is just wrong. I admire your ability to return and post messages even though you have been caught out as completely ignorant on numerous occasions. I thank you for the unintended complement though, where you describe my experiences as a ‘fantasy’, and I admit that I was lucky enough to enjoy Halloween in the Irish countryside. The things that I have outlined in my post are still enjoyed and practiced.

Kinvara's post comes to us straight from fantasyland. The fact is that the modern Irish are totally cut off from their Halloween traditions. They have bought in 100% to the American version. Kinvara is so naive that he doesn't understand this, instead giving us his Leprechaunland fantasy of Irish Halloween.

@John: I don’t think you understand Halloween. What you refer to as traditions (expensive decorations and costumes; the pressure to have plenty of expensive sweets) are just the unfortunate commercialization of an ancient celebration. I’m sure many Americans would trade those things to be able to enjoy a bonfire near the ruins of a castle. I think you’re so caught up in the superficial Halloween that you can’t see the value of ‘apples and nuts’. Apples have been long associated with the Irish Halloween and many games revolve around them, like bobbing for them in a big bowl of water. Fruits were associated with Halloween, in part due to the myth of the pouca, a spirit that roamed the country spoiling all the fruit and making them no longer edible after Oíche Shamhna. I remember our Teacher going through those myths in the run up to Halloween. What about traditions such as the barnbrack cake etc? A lot of these traditions could be described as invisible, because they were carried in the hearts and minds of the people or celebrated at home, but Halloween was still very important.

It's perhaps very American to think of Halloween as just for kids.