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| A group of participants at the Nigerian Irish Expo in 2009 in Dublin |
Probably the most talked about story here over the past week has been the allegedly racist comments made by a local politician called Darren Scully, the mayor of Naas, a large commuter town about 20 miles from Dublin in Co. Kildare.
Scully said in an interview last week on a local radio station that he had a problem with black African immigrants who are now living in the Naas area and who were coming to see him about issues like housing and welfare benefits.
There is nothing unusual in people going to see local politicians to get their help in accessing council housing or welfare benefits. But Scully said in an interview on local radio last week that he would no longer represent black Africans in his area because of their attitude.
"I have been met with aggressiveness and bad manners," he said.
The story received blanket coverage not least because Scully is a Fine Gael councilor, and there was an immediate focus on how embarrassing his remarks were for the government.
The media here, all singing from the same hymn sheet, condemned him and demanded action from the powers that be. In these politically correct times, an incident like this provokes a furious reaction, and it did not take long for party headquarters to lean on him.
Within a day, Scully had acknowledged his error, publicly and abjectly apologized and handed back his mayor's chain of office.
But it did not end there. Scully works as a structural engineer for a small private company (he is a part-time politician), and he now says he has been suspended and could lose his job.
He says the reaction to his remarks has been so intense that he has been close to a breakdown. He says he has been subjected to a torrent of abuse, and that the experience has almost destroyed him.
Media commentators are still calling for his head. A Labor politician has reported his remarks to the Gardai (police) for a possible criminal prosecution. Various organizations demanded that he be excluded from politics altogether.
A support group for African immigrants held a press conference which criticized him and also pointed to the killing of an African taxi driver in Dublin recently as evidence of how serious racism here has become (although it is not yet clear whether this was primarily a racist attack).
By the time you read this Fine Gael may have thrown Scully out of the party altogether, although he remains a councilor until the next election, unless he resigns his seat.
This whole controversy is interesting for a number of reasons. For a start, although official Ireland and the media turned on Scully as though he was Hitler reborn, what he actually said was relatively moderate.
He said the Africans who had come to see him had been aggressive and bad mannered. He did not say that all Africans had behaved towards him in this way. He did not say that he never had to put up with aggressiveness and bad manners from other immigrant groups or from Irish people who came to see him.
But he did say that he would no longer represent black Africans because of the general attitude he had experienced. Even if not all of them had been aggressive or rude to him, he clearly felt enough of them had behaved in this way so that he was justified in excluding them as a group from his political services.
And that is racist. It is taking a decision for an entire group based on skin color/ethnic origin rather than on an assessment of people as individuals.
Racism is something that cannot be tolerated, either in Ireland or anywhere else. But even with that as a guiding principle, there should be room for discussion here about what former Mayor Scully was expressing.
In these politically correct times in Ireland, however, no such discussion is possible. Anyone who attempts to start such a discussion is immediately called a racist and is vilified and ostracized, as Scully has been.
He was both stupid and naive if he thought he could make comments like he did without provoking a backlash of political correctness from official Ireland.
But one of the interesting things about the controversy was the wide difference of opinion between official Ireland and the majority of anonymous people who went on-line or rang up radio stations about the issue over the past week. It looked to me like 70 or 80 percent of people supported Scully, to some degree at least.
The reaction varied from a few outright racists to many more people with moderate views who are deeply concerned about the ongoing effect of the immigration that took place here during the Celtic Tiger decade.
The reaction in general was an illustration not only of how sensitive the immigration issue is here, but how that sensitivity is increasing as the pressure of cutbacks and unemployment intensifies. With huge cuts in state spending on the way over the next few years, this is likely to get worse.
The way to deal with the pent-up concern or anger here on the issue is not by smothering it under a wall of political correctness. That increases the frustration of the people who do not agree that sharing scarce resources in a multi-cultural Ireland is a wonderful, life-enhancing development.
Rather than propaganda, what is needed is honest, open and realistic discussion.
The scale of immigration that took place here in the last decade and a half was higher per capita than in any other country in the western world. Was that necessarily a good thing, given the pressure that schools, hospitals and our welfare system are now under? Or was it another mistake that we made during the Celtic Tiger years?
Even though we are continually told that multi-culturalism is good for us, have Irish people the right to say that, actually, they preferred the way things used to be? And if they do, does that make them racist?
Let's take one example. The relentless propaganda about the benefits of multi-culturalism makes little impression on many parents in areas here where there is a high concentration of immigrants.
In commuter towns and suburbs around Dublin and other cities, there is particular pressure on schools which have a high number of immigrant children who do not have English as a first language or who have no English at all.
In some classes in primary schools, more than half the children may have little or no English, which means the teacher takes much longer to get through lessons. This means that the progress of the Irish kids is much slower that it used to be.
Of course there were promises of extra language support teachers for these schools, but the resources available are a fraction of what would be needed to deal with the situation.
How would you, as the parent of an Irish child, feel if you were confronted with this problem, especially if you realize that that it could mean that your child will still be behind when he or she leaves school and tries to get a college place or a job?
That's what multi-culturalism means in practice in some areas here. No one denies that being able to get a flavor of other cultures is interesting. But the happy clappy propaganda that insists multi-culturalism is creating a far better new Ireland does not convince many people who deal with it on the ground on a daily basis.
Schools are just one area where this pressure is visible. There is intense competition for the few jobs that become available, with downward pressure on wages.
The lines outside welfare payment offices get longer. The overcrowding in hospitals gets worse.
Rightly or wrongly, our high level of immigration is now perceived by many of the people who have expressed support for former Mayor Scully as part of the problem, especially since the economy has tanked and state spending on all kinds of services is shrinking fast.
The increased competition for increasingly scarce resources is producing tension, both among and between immigrants and locals. It is against that background that the Scully controversy must be seen. On a general level, there are cultural differences between the Irish and some immigrants, and between different groups of immigrants, which can mean they do not easily co-exist in every situation.
There is no value judgment between cultures involved in this observation. It's not racist, merely a statement of fact. To pretend otherwise is disingenuous.
This question of cultural difference may possibly be a factor in Scully's difficulty with his black African constituents. Most of the Africans here are from Nigeria, and as a group they tend to be louder and more assertive than most Irish people. Not all of them, but many of them.
This is not something negative and it is certainly understandable. To make yourself heard and to survive in a teeming city like Lagos (or many other cities in Africa) you have to be loud and assertive.
Given the competition and the corruption, you may even have to be aggressive in some situations. The etiquette of queuing is different, as is putting your case to officials.
In Ireland, the tendency is to line up in a subdued, orderly manner and to put your case or make your request quietly, almost apologetically. It's just the way we are. We don't like to make a fuss. We never complain in restaurants because we don't want to cause any embarrassment.
The Nigerians, by and large, are not hampered by such reticence and demand their rights in an assertive manner. As I said, it's a cultural difference.
These differences do not make either us or them bad people. It does not mean that an immigrant is of less value as a human being than an Irish person. We are all equal.
But there are differences. And these differences can cause problems, as Scully has found out to his cost.
This is a situation that will need careful management in the immediate future as the pressures increase. The various quangos set up by official Ireland which deal with immigration issues seem incapable of more than wishful thinking about the benefits of multi-culturalism.
Everything will be all right, they keep saying. Official Ireland wants to be like a Coca-Cola commercial teaching Ireland to sing in perfect harmony.
But real life is more complicated than that. Just ask former Mayor Scully.
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Switch to the desktop site to post a comment.Saoirse9 | Dec 03, 2011, 10:22 AM EST
Thank you, Mr. Spain, for one of the more thoughtful articles I have read here in a long time.
RockNReel | Dec 03, 2011, 06:26 AM EST
I do not like to single out a particular race of people but facts are facts so here goes. The Nigerians in particular have created a lot of resentment and they make it more difficult for law abiding asylum seeker who have genuine cases. There are numerous incidents in Ireland that are well documented of where they have used and abused the system to get what they want. One Nigerian woman alone cost the tax payers over one million euros by taking her case to the European court only to be exposed as a cheat and scammer. She was a wealthy Nigerian who thought her money would open the floodgates for others and allow them flow into Ireland.She was claiming all sorts of allowances and benifits for years while living here while still owning a mansion back in her hometown in Nigeria. She is one of thousands who cheat and lie their way to try get in here. Most of them claim to be one parent families while their husbands sneak in through Northern Ireland for visits every few weeks while most of these husbands are working in the Uk on good money. Its all a Scam!! And the Irish government would want to wake up. I have a sister who works as a hairdresser and recently a Nigerian lady came in for full hair treatment as well as manicure and facial---the works!! When she came up to pay she presented a medical card and my sisiter said I'm sorry thats not money we need cash or card etc. She immediately roared and shouted around the saloon causing chaos and eventually came up with a phone number of the Social Services that my sister should ring. And sure enough when the official answered at the other end he said Yes Thats Fine--we will cover her treatment!! Unbelievable with so many of our poor on the poverty line that we can afford to pay for foreigners beauty treatments !!
tievemore | Dec 02, 2011, 11:52 PM EST
Well done John. Very nice article. After many years away, I recently returned to Ireland on a visit. I was struck by the number of immigrants in Dublin. I commented a few times with the locals about the number of African cab drivers. No one would engage me in conversation regarding this observation. They quickly turned the subject. I soon realized to bring up even such an obvious observation was viewed as "racist" (as I was told a few times) to the locals. I thought to myself, "as juvenile as Americans can be regarding the issue of race, at least we often engage the subject, the Irish won't even acknowledge it". While Europe might pride itself on a number of things, engaging and discussing the issue of race is not one of those things. Thank you for at least making an attempt John.
awoken32 | Dec 02, 2011, 11:59 AM EST
i see you ran into those fools on the other page there george,two gobshites the pair of them,trust me they are the minority,they respect everyones rights over their own peoples,something else eh? enemy of the state plain an simple
awoken32 | Dec 02, 2011, 11:28 AM EST
IRELAND FOR THE INDIGINUS IRISH AN NOT FOR A MELTING POT OF DIVISION,The world is a great place because of differant cultures,it would be destroyed by this maddness of mass invasions,it only causes divisions,people come to ireland to experiance our culture an people,a lot them coming back to their roots,our brothers an sisters,but then we have mass immigration,which is completly differant,its differant cultures coming here on mass to change the demographics of our island,it will only cause division in the country,the only end result is no more ireland as ireland should be,mass deportations need to be done,a review of citizenship needs to be done,OUT OF EVERYTHING IN THE WORLD,THERE IS ONE THING THAT MONEY CANT BUY,AN THAT IS YOUR HERITAGE YOUR OWN PEOPLE,IT MAKES US WHO WE ARE FOR GODSAKE,WHICH EVER WAY WE GET THE BALL ROLLING TO REVESRE THIS MADNESS,IT HAS TO BE DONE,ORGANISE A MASSIVE MARCH IN DUBLIN CITY CENTRE,OR A COLLECTIVE MARCH IN COUNTIES THROUGHOUT,ORGANISE A REALIST POLITICAL PARTY,MAKE THE CORRUPTED PARTIES IN POWER AWARE THAT THE PEOPLE ARE NOT HAVING THIS TREASON ANYMORE,A WEBSITE IN WHICH TO GATHER NAMES AN GET A GROUP OF LIKEMINDED PEOPLE TOGETHER,OR MARK MY WORDS IT WILL TURN INTO A WAR,JUST MY OPINION MIND YOU,EITHER WAY THIS HAS TO STOP,SOMETHINGS ARE WORTH DYING FOR
EamonnDublin | Dec 02, 2011, 10:56 AM EST
I am not sure from his last sentence if "GeorgeDillon" is aware that the Irish state pays child benefits to, for example, a non-Irish male whose wife and children are still in their own country. Thus, the Irish taxpayer is actually sending money abroad for the upkeep of foreign children simply because their father is living in Ireland. You just couldn't make it up! In addition to that scandal, for some years, until the government belatedly changed the rules, one member of a group of foreign nationals who had worked in Ireland would get a cheap flight to Dublin once a month and collect the Irish unemployment benefit for himself and some of his mates who had returned to live and work in their own country! Talk about "Céad Míle Fáilte"!! Now, please excuse me whilst I ask this passing gentleman how many times it is that we have to face Mecca every day............
GeorgeDillon | Dec 02, 2011, 10:07 AM EST
awoken32--that's well put. The womb is more powerful than the gun, and it's the womb which will bring an end to Irish ethnicity in Ireland. Already predictions are that by the middle of this century (and probably earlier, because the predictions were made before the current wave of Emigration hit Ireland) the Irish will be an ethnic minority in their own ancient homeland. The Irish will look at each other in consternation and say: "How did we let this happen? We are now foreigners in our own land." That's when you'll see the Irish language coming off the road signs and public documenets, the Irish language tv station closing down, the Irish language taken out of the school curriculum, to be replaced by Polish or Urdu or Lingala. And the crazy irony is that the Irish state pays generous child welfare benefits to foreign children born in Ireland!
IrelandNorth | Dec 02, 2011, 07:41 AM EST
There is an institutionalised reverse dis-crimination in the Irish real politik which causes reverse discrimination against native Irish. As a Dubliner, I am regularly jostled past by foreign nationals to get a seat in the Central Library.
AMWilson | Dec 01, 2011, 10:02 PM EST
Wake up, Ireland - the Irish Descendents of the world spend their tourist dollars/pounds in Ireland because they want to be amongst their kinfolk. I have nothing against other cultures, but my concern is with Irish culture and Irish identity, and when these are gone, hopelessly watered down by a hundred other cultures, Ireland will no longer be a place worth visiting.
IrishInTX | Dec 01, 2011, 04:08 PM EST
@Spain "The Nigerians, by and large, are not hampered by such reticence and demand their rights in an assertive manner. As I said, it's a cultural difference." I will respectfully disagree, the manner is not assertive; it is agressive and that is called VERBAL ABUSE, which no one is entitled to unleash at will. Nor is this type of behavior restricted to just African Nigerians, African Americans behave the same way after generations of EEOC, job preferences at less than stellar test scores, welfare, SNAP, aid to dependent children, Medicaid, free cell phones, Section 8 housing, corruption and fraud. People are tired of it, and we want the African culture to understand that this behavior has reached a threshold of intolerance. I have lived in and worked in many multicultural environments and I have never seen people from Pakistan, India, Turkey, Iran, Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Mexican or people emminenting from a culture of dark skin, olive complexion go off like the people of African descent and feel like if they say it louder and more often, it makes them more correct. Most people choose to exercise their manners, and when you don't there is nothing racist about it - just an attitude of entitlement and ignorance. Scully should not have given up his job, he should have called the police and had them arrested for abuse. Abuse it not part of being politically correct.
awoken32 | Dec 01, 2011, 01:55 PM EST
As racists go the irish simply are not racist at all,we are a charitable country of good an honest people for the most,we are a respected throughout the world because of this,we do not bother or threaten any countries indiginus population or culture,we respect other peoples culture,if mass immigration does not halt with a mass deportation program put in place in order to balance the worries for our culture to flourish,it is in no way racist to want to preserve our identity and our irishness,NEVER LET ANYONE SAY TO YOU THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS INDIGINUS IRISH,THAT IS A RACIST POLITICAL CORRECTNESS RUBBISH,OUR ANCESTORS DIED IN THE MILLIONS AN BUILT UP YHIS BEUTIFUL COUNTRY FOR OUR GENERATION,WE SHOULD NEVER FORGET THAT,AN PASS ON AN IRELAND OUR KIDS CAN BE PROUD OF,IT IS OUR DUTY AS IRISH PEOPLE,WHAT IS SO WRONG WITH THAT?
awoken32 | Dec 01, 2011, 01:12 PM EST
I blame the political correctness/wrongness for the indocturnation of the people,you can get done on a thought crime nowadays,even to speak the truth is a crime,your correct about america,the natives/indiginus people an culture destoyed ,then we have the aboriginees the exact same thing happened them,they would have loved the chance that we have now,the power to stop this madness before its to late for our people,more importanly our childrens future,we should all have learned a lessons from the past,the indians and the aboriginees got wiped out by the gun,but our country is getting atttacked by a more stealth weapon,the womb,we will simply be bread out of existance,if a true political party formed in ireland that truly stands for the people it would grow at an enormous rate,because the dog on the street could tell you the thoughts of the people on this matter,our politcans are so corrupted by greed,they get the fat wage packets an pensions to just keep carrying out the orders of there masters,that they a foolishly killing there own people their own kids future,the leading political parties are all the same they just argue infront of the cameras,the oppostion slag of the people in the hot seats so the peole think they are in oppostion,when the only thing that matters is the wage packet when you get into power,the policies an agenda stay the same,differant face with the same mask,politicans have no accoubtability at all for the crimes they commit on their own people,they should be done for treason,WE NEED A PATRIOTIC UNWAVERING IRISH PARTY
simplesandy | Dec 01, 2011, 12:26 PM EST
Well it is sad that the Irish culture is being taken away like many other cultures of the world. For some reason people come into a country and try to change it to what they left. Now to be honest the Americans are guilty of this and reasonably so. They had to leave their homeland to try to make it in another country (America) and so to have memories of their hameland they built communities around those memories. As for changing the law they were still making the law. Even though the American Indians were taken and forced to learn the other cultures. Today we live in a world where not too many people care for anyone else but themselves. WE LIVE IN A ME ME ME WORLD. Won’t be long before Ireland will have no culture. The youth are being forced out and the natives are moving in. pretty soon Ireland will have a country of nothing but BLOW-INS.
awoken32 | Dec 01, 2011, 11:33 AM EST
Every single country has had mass immigration forced on them,because lets face it,no indiginus people were asked on the matter,there was no mandate,the indiginus people an culture suffers greatly,an lets not beat around the bush here,it will only lead to the destruction of the culture an indiginus majority,these are just facts,you only have to look at other european countries to see the true facts,we in ireland are only in the early stages an already look at the change,it is a massive differance,in what 10 years or so,there is no cap on the numbr the country can take in,it is illegal,and has no mandate from the irish people,the law says,if you are fleeing persecution you are meant to go to the nearest country to your to your border an not travel the whole of europe to get to ireland,that is illegal,FACT,im am not a arcist i am a realist,and i simply want my country an people respected and allowed to flourish,our ancestors would turn in the grave,if they could see what is happening this country,its a disgrace,our polticans are nothing more than money grabbing banking solicitors,were is the pride?were is the partiots?we need a party that represents the people and culture/future of this country an not a party that represents political correctness/wrongness,were is the common sence gone?
SeamusMor | Dec 01, 2011, 11:03 AM EST
Si fueris Romae, Romano vivito more!When in Rome, do as the Romans. Limerick is not Lagos, and Navan is not Nigeria. People who come to Ireland must adhere to IRISH customs, not the reverse.
EamonnDublin | Dec 01, 2011, 10:27 AM EST
Thank you, John Spain! In the early and mid 1990's I stood in an Irish by-election and also in a general election for Dáil Éireann, on the single issue of crime. My family and I had suffered hugely following an assault on me when my car was being stolen in 1984, and therefore crime was an issue which really concerned me. I was surprised when I was canvassing for votes, because a good 7 out of 10 people with whom I spoke said that they were more concerned by the number of immigrants in Ireland than they were with the crime issue. Now, if these people were saying this to me, it is very obvious that they were voicing those same concerns to all of the candidates who were standing in those elections. However, no politician has EVER spoken on the issue. They are therefore NOT representing the views of their constituents, but, rather, cowering in a corner afraid of being called a racist if they so much as call for a debate. In a subsequent letter to the Irish Times (which was printed) I related the above and I stated that if we do not debate the situation we are facing possible racial tension - and worse - in the not too distant future. We have STILL not had anybody in authority in the country with either the integrity or the guts to call for that debate. Éamonn Gavin, Dublin.
cillowen | Dec 01, 2011, 10:17 AM EST
the cuisine smells alone that are now wafting through irish neighbourhoods is a sickening thing for the natives, without delving too far afield. Ireland of the welcomes is but a thing largely gone. Blowin lovers are turning a blind eye for jesus and enjoy his uffering. All will be set right in the herafter, just you wait 'enry 'iggins.
donegalcali | Nov 30, 2011, 05:21 PM EST
Excellent article. Moderate and sensible. There needs to be room for discussion for other concerns. Blocking out or preventing people from airing their views breeds frustration and bitterness. I think that genuine immigrants should be assimilated in reasonable numbers that reflect a certain proportion of the country. Though it seems like it is uncontrolled . The amount of Irish leaving to the amount of immigrants coming in is alarming. Unfortunately like the London rant lady, these views are being aired by idiots and low class drunks so the argument goes down the tubes with the reason. Like i said before it is ludicrous that someone from another country aggressively demands free housing in another country. Its embarrassing for them that they cant support themselves yet they see no shame. On another note there re many many other african immigrants in Ireland who are amazing people who work hard and mannerly to boot.
Towngate | Nov 30, 2011, 05:01 PM EST
Mayor Scully seems to have made a serious mistake - but wait! - I wonder has he? He put his finger on an uncomfortable Irish Home Truth and has been knocked out in round one. If he has the stomach for the fight and can harness that 80% support you mention,John,and go on to win the war. He should have stood his ground, provided specific examples of what he alleges,and stated loud and clear "I don't care what you say or what you do to me, but I can clearly see the Emperors willy waggling in the wind." > > > Btw: Has Ireland got some sort of racket going on with Nigeria,in particular, that we don't know about?
awoken32 | Nov 30, 2011, 12:45 PM EST
WE NEED A REALIST NATIONALIST THAT REPRESENTS THE PEOLE AS THE POLITICANS CERTAINLY TO NOT SPEAK FOR OR REPRESENT THEIR OWN PEOPLE
awoken32 | Nov 30, 2011, 12:43 PM EST
all they do is bring in an glorify ghetto culture the create division an hate,they are a rot on the society in which they invade,deportation is the only way to deal with them,mass deportation an review of citizenship also
RedBranch | Nov 30, 2011, 12:42 PM EST
Anger stalks the land and is looking for scapegoats! God protect a white, male, hetrosexual, former banker now govt. employee who supports Israel in a narrow ally on a dark night. (not that there would be many of those, but you get the idea).
averagejoewa | Nov 30, 2011, 12:05 PM EST
In general, blacks are only good at violence and other forms of criminal activity. If the politicians of Ireland had any sense they would round up all the blacks and send them back to Africa where they belong.
GeorgeDillon | Nov 30, 2011, 09:57 AM EST
Good article, Spain. Moderate and balanced. What I wonder about is why no political party has emerged in Ireland to challenge the Mass Immigrationists. There are parties all around Europe who have as a central policy plank that Mass Immigration must end or indeed be reversed. I'm not talking about the National Front in Britain, they're racists. I'm referring to sophisticated and liberal parties in places such as Holland, Finland, Flanders, Italy etc. How come nothing like that in Ireland? There is no evidence that the majority of Irish people support or ever supported Mass Immigration, yet that majority has not found a political expression. Irish politics are fossilized and conservative. With the exception of the tiny group of Trotskyites, the parties in the Dail are essentailly the same parties that were there almost 90 years ago. We see the result of this conservatism--A Failed State.
Springfield9 | Nov 30, 2011, 09:55 AM EST
Well, the educated Irish are (once again) leaving old Eire ....... and an uneducated, unassimilated, non-native culture is moving in. Multi-culturalism, Diversity (whatever you choose) is a load of progressivist crap. Nigeria is NOT a poverty stricken nation. Why would a Nigerian travel to Ireland for the welfare? Years ago, there was but one phonebook for all of Ireland. Today, you can't even pronounce the names in the phone book. Will the last Kelly or Murphy to leave please lock the door?