Irelands Census 2011 and Catholicism - the demise of organized religion in Ireland
Posted on Monday, March 28, 2011 at 09:49 AM
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Read more: The Irish are fast losing their religion say experts
On Sunday, 10th April the people of Ireland will fill in their census forms under wildly different circumstances than when they last did so in 2006. But aside from the inevitable stark figures surrounding employment and the people who’ve had to leave the country to get it, there is another question that will also speak volumes: the question on religion.
Apart from the usual campaigns to get Jedi Knight or Pastafarianism officially on the books, or this year in particular augment the number of people who claim no religion, this year’s religion statistics will be a crucial chapter in an intriguing story.
In 1981, when priests were still more feared than the guards, the percentage of Roman Catholic people in Ireland was 93%. In 1991, a couple of years before my first communion, the figure was 91.6%. By 2002, around the time our school chaplain conducted our catechism-heavy Leaving Cert religion class, that was down to 88.4% and by 2006 it was down again to 86.8%. Now granted, the physical numbers of people self-identifying as Catholic has actually gone up along with the population, but that may be coming to an end.
First of all, in the same thirty year stretch that self-identifying Catholics went down by 6%, the amount of people claiming no religion quadrupled. Secondly, what the figures don’t account for is the amount of nominal Catholics, those who go to mass at Easter or Christmas and other such events but otherwise wouldn’t attend religiously. As it were. It’s those people that will likely signal a watershed moment in Irish life. For while the changes in Ireland’s economic structure have been noisy and tumultuous, a much more quiet social revolution has been building steam over the last few years, and it’ll come to a head soon.
Back in 2006, I wouldn’t have dreamt of putting down anything other than Roman Catholic on the census form. Now, there’s no way in Hades I’d tick that box. In 2006 I was happy to belong to the broad church, as it were, comfortable with the idea that mass was the way I demonstrated faith even if I personally disagreed with large swathes of Catholic doctrine, focusing more on the spirit rather than the letter of the law. Five years later, a combination of the deplorable revelations of the Murphy and Ryan reports and general exasperation at the Church’s increasingly insane intransigence eventually made me give up. I’m hardly the only one.
If as I suspect the number of people identifying as Catholics drops quite sharply in this census (or indeed the one after) that in itself will be significant, but more significant still will be the way that bears out in real life. A great many social events in Ireland still revolve around the Church, like baptisms, communions and confirmations. A lot of people who aren’t ardent mass-goers still attend these events, either through social convention, a residual sense of duty, keeping up appearances or just wanting a quiet life. More and more, they’re treated as pageants with an hour-long sit surrounded by stained glass attached anyway. Priests may disapprove of that, but so weak is their bargaining position nowadays, they can hardly turn down the business. But what happens when people eventually decide they won’t go through the pseudo-religious motions anymore, especially people of my generation who’ll likely be having the majority of their kids in the next decade or so? That answer to the question will depend on education.
The Church doesn’t just hold a lot of the cards in terms of social functions; it also controls the vast, vast majority of primary school administration. If you apply to be a teacher in a primary school a priest will be on the interviewing panel, and if you want to send your child to that school then communion and confirmation prep will form a large proportion of their second and sixth class, with a healthy dose of religion thrown in all the other years. If you’re not comfortable with that, your options aren’t exactly extensive.
In certain situations the Church seem willing to relinquish that control and if they do, like the census figures themselves, the attendance at religious rituals not really adhered to will slide gradually but noticeably, as indeed is proper. But if the Church doesn’t move quickly enough, or far enough, then a new generation of non-believers who have no allegiance to Catholicism, aren’t afraid to say as much and not inclined to pass it on will not be slow to question the absurdity of the status quo. The census on the 10th April is, in one form or another, likely to prompt a High Noon that’s been a long time coming. Thank God for that.
Read more: The Irish are fast losing their religion say experts
76 comments
OGollaher | Apr 03, 2011, 03:15 PM EDT
Sad - It seems that Irish are slowly abandoning the Church for mostly the wrong reasons, i.e. a lack of faith in general. Although my Irish ancestors were Catholic (O'Gallagher, you know), most of the American Gollahers have been members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints ('Mormon') since said church was founded in America in the 1830s. Here, at least, 'Mormons' and Catholics have forged a social, political and even theological bond that is unique and most satisfying. For me, especially.
If you must abandon the Catholic church for whatever personal reasons, at least keep your faith alive in Jesus Christ through some other communal faith that may sustain you and yours; preferably one which will respect the historical greatness of the Catholic Church, despite its' seeming flaws. Your ancestors put a lot of time and energy into their faith, and are the reason you have such freedoms to decide for yourself today.
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jacersagain | Apr 03, 2011, 12:49 PM EDT
No mimi – it appears that Irish Central’s IT systems are set up to NOT post any posts that contain website addresses. That is why you get the message ‘Comment has been sent’ (but not posted). This is a measure seemingly put in place to stop spammers, no reflection on YOU or your posts; don’t get paranoid about it. It is a pity that ICentral’s IT Dept has had to do this. Many honest posters here would welcome that freedom again. Thanks for the invite to email you but since you SHOUT a lot, I won’t avail of yr invite. FYI – I am posting this again as my original post was not accepted because it used ‘banned’ letters! ;)
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jacersagain | Apr 03, 2011, 12:46 PM EDT
No mimi – it appears that Irish Central’s IT systems are set up to NOT post any posts that contain http or www addresses. That is why you get the message ‘Comment has been sent’ (but not posted). This is a measure seemingly put in place to stop spammers, no reflection on YOU or your posts; don’t get paranoid about it. It is a pity that ICentral’s IT Dept has had to do this. Many honest posters here would welcome that freedom again. Thanks for the invite to email you but since you SHOUT a lot, I won’t avail of yr kind invite.
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mimimcd | Apr 03, 2011, 12:24 PM EDT
SO WHY DID YOU JUST REMOVE THE PREVIOUS ONE I SENT WITH MY EMAIL ADDRESS FOR ALL TO CONTACT ME WITH THE CATHOLIC INFO I TRIED TO PRESENT?
ANYONE INTERESTED IN VALUALBE CATHOLIC INFO BEING SURPRESSED, PLEASE EMAIL MIMI7114711@YAHOO.COM
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mimimcd | Apr 03, 2011, 12:21 PM EDT
HOW ABOUT THAT....THAT WAS POSTED INSTANTLY...WHAT HAPPENED TO YOU SINCE JOINING THE EU....COMMUNIST CONTROL OF WHAT'S POSTED? OBVIOUSLY, OR YOU WOULD HAVE POSTED THE VALUABLE CATHOLIC INFO I SENT!
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mimimcd | Apr 03, 2011, 12:17 PM EDT
WHERE'S MY COMMENT.....BEING EDITED BECAUSE IT SPELLS OUT AND DIRECTS PEOPLE TO THE TRUTH?!!! ANYONE OUT THERE WHO WOULD LIKE TO TALK MORE ABOUT TRUE CATHOLICISM AND YOUR POSTS HERE WITH SOMEONE OF FULL IRISH HERITAGE IN THE U.S. (WHO WOULD LOVE TO COME HOME) EMAIL ME AT MIMI7114711@YAHOO.COM YOURS IN JMJ
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jacersagain | Apr 03, 2011, 11:02 AM EDT
(...more) I realised, with a quiet and utmost shocking humility, as we two from two different ends of our planet stood on the same open ground, surrounded by the ruins of a once magnificent Irish monastery, that old Jay saw what I had failed to see as we two walked amongst the ruins... that Catholicism, of both Irish and Australian kinds, was still around with us there, a thousand years after the demise of the monastery. Its ruins are still standing. Its altar place is still to be found, its Holy Communion rail’s foundations are still to be seen. Its round Lavabo structure is still intact. It is remarkable that an Australian Catholic visiting Monasterboice should have being pointing it all out to me, a native Dublin Catholic. >>> No matter what this latest Irish Census’ statistics say, a thousand years from now the celebration by Irish Catholics of the same sacrifice of Christ as was celebrated on Monasterboice’s altars eons ago and that of its descendant Irish Catholics concelebrating with their celebrations, will be still celebrated, even if it's amongst ruins like me and Jay were, walking amongst Monasterboice’s structural ruins that day. They will still be around over a thousand years from now after all those who attack Catholicism today are long dead. I am privileged to have learned from Jay, the ordinary family Australian man; Jay ‘Lavabo’ed’ me that day without his knowing so. I hope Mr. Duffy and all lapsed and lapsing Catholics will be similarly ‘Lavabo’ed’ by someone as ordinary as tommymccarthy or Gearoid4, or as ordinary as Jay, if you are lucky enough to meet him in Australia. That is, barring tragedies of a scale similar to Japan’s earthquake, tsunami and nuclear events.
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jacersagain | Apr 03, 2011, 10:58 AM EDT
(...more) As Jay’s experienced builder’s eyes were spanning around the ruins of the old Catholic Church, he turned to me, shouting as he pointed to a stone-marked place “Hey (jacers)... There is where the altar was! That’s where Consecrations took place. ... And that there is where Holy Communion was made by the people – see the footings of the altar rails here?” he said, trotting (in the way that an old man does) over to and excitedly pointing at some ground-bedded stones laid out in a straight line in front of the rectangular altar place. Both of us had received Holy Communion at Mass earlier that day. I was amazed that he could show and point out to me, a native Irish Dublin Catholic who has visited and enjoyed being amongst the ruins of Monasterboice a few times, where others of the Catholic faith, over a thousand years before us two, had partaken of exactly the same as we had partaken of earlier that day. (More...)
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jacersagain | Apr 03, 2011, 10:56 AM EDT
On this Census topic by Paddy Duffy I tell an aside, yet relevant bit of a story... A few years ago, I had an extraordinary experience. An Australian Catholic man (I’ll call him Jay in this true story) was visiting Ireland for a special occasion. I'd met Jay only once before, in Australia. While visiting in Ireland for this occasion, he expressed to me an interest to visit a really old Catholic, Irish Church place. So I took him to visit the ruins of a monastery far north of me dear Dublin city, to a place in Co. Louth called Monasterboice (google that name, or google ‘St. Buithe’ for more info. It is very popular with tourists, city-escapers and the place’s own area locals for some odd reason, and also an archeologically important site in Ireland). On the day, it turned out that we were the only two people there at the time we dropped in. All was quiet, except for some birds chirruping, the sound of a little wind and our own feet crunching on pebbles in the quietness of the countryside. Though it was a cold winter’s day, the sun was shining warmly and we didn’t need our jackets. Jay is an ordinary family man, a retired Builder and as he looked around the part-remaining standing walls of the ruined monastery, he was able to see the walls of what was formerly a large church, something I’d never noticed before in the huge, stoned complex of this former monastery. I had been excited to direct him to the perfectly formed and still beautifully intact structure known as the Lavabo until he pointed out other structures to me (More...)
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jacersagain | Apr 03, 2011, 10:52 AM EDT
Sorry eiriamach but yr posts are getting tiresome on this topic, seeming to be frantically rooting around for reasons to support Paddy Duffy’s public defection from the Church and at the same time throwing discreditable reasons on those who proclaim loyalty to our Church in the face of adversity. The Church has changed throughout all of its centuries and will continue to change but not one of those changes will impact on the central tenet of its ‘raison d’être’. If people will bear with my next posts, I hopefully will prove why.
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JimMcGarity | Apr 02, 2011, 07:46 PM EDT
It is a changing world. And not for the better. Look around, people just dont have any respect for each other anymore. So do be surprised.
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eiriamach | Apr 02, 2011, 06:34 PM EDT
Jacers, "systemic" means pervasive, existing throughout the whole structure. Surely there have been and still are many 'good' priests. But they take oaths of obedience to the Holy See; in consequence, they remain silent about the felonies of their colleague priests. The Vatican still refuses to tell priests to give any and all evidence of clerical crimes to civil authorities. It still insists on being a law unto itself, above all just laws enacted by civil society. Christ gave no warrant for such behavior. Unequivocally good priests work to reform this system, to make it less autocratic, to open it to scrutiny and democratic processes. The people of God deserve no less, and no other structure will long survive. Listen to the voices calling for change; look at the handwriting on the wall. And yes, you do engage in a strategy of insults and threats to deflect the impact of the truth. You write, "Catholics who deny the RCC and its mission, risk allowing Satan to perpetuate his evil work within the Church and being part of it," "eeejits like Paddy Duffy above who are so swamped by populist fashion that they can’t see the wood for the trees," and "unfounded hysteria." Others adopt a posture of superiority: "This gent Newrone should be more pitted [a Freudian slip for 'pitied'?] than laugh't at." Insults, ad hominems, red herrings, all unresponsive to the question at issue: how to change a corrupt system?
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glorybe1929 | Apr 02, 2011, 05:43 PM EDT
Christ's message is simple. Either HE invites you to belong to Him and you say "Yes to Him" or you don't. Nothing the RCC can say can change that FACT. He calls you...you don't call HIM!
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glorybe1929 | Apr 02, 2011, 05:40 PM EDT
Don't lose Jesus Christ because of an Institution. Keep the BabyJesus and throw out the putrid water HEis being bathed in.
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