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Periscope by Niall O'Dowd

Is Catholic Church getting bad rap on pedophiles? Misguided forgiveness at heart of church scandal says expert

Posted on Saturday, July 30, 2011 at 10:11 AM
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A leading Catholic lay figure I know who is a deeply compassionate and caring man gives a different read on the church crisis in Ireland than you will read anywhere else.

His points are thought provoking.

Essentially, he says the reason the matter of child abuse got out of hand can be found at the very kernel of the meaning of being a Catholic priest.

"The entire philosophy is based on forgiveness, whether it is confession or in daily life" he says." They are thought first and foremost in the seminary that Jesus forgave even the most dreadful of sins."

He argues that when fellow priests and bishops were faced with men who had abused children, their initial response was to forgive, as they had been trained to do all their church lives.

He says, categorically, that it was the wrong response, However, he says the fact that they knew the guilty men, that the men probably pleaded for forgiveness, that, as in any body of men attracted to the same mission, they felt deeply about them, then forgiveness seemed a viable and often best option.

He is not denying that was not the motive of many who feared the damage for the church first and foremost not the victims.

But he believes many who allowed the priests back into practice were motivated by the aspect of the church's teachings, most stressed by the teaching of Jesus, the ability to forgive.

However, he believes it may come down to the American church to save the Irish one, which essentially created the American church from their own history of priests emigrating here.

Several bishops from America, including Egan in New York and O'Malley in Boston have been called in to staunch the tide.

The heart of it my friend says must be the American principle of no more cover ups, but he says it is vital that the aspect of forgiveness not be overlooked as a factor in the massive scandal that has ensued.

"I think many were not bad men, but misguided, who had the aspect of forgiveness as their main reason for allowing bad priests to continue. I do not believe they covered up in order to endanger children but they believed the offending priest could be made to see the error of his ways and change his life."

There you have it, interesting and thought provoking as I said.


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ancavker | Aug 01, 2011, 12:00 PM EDT
yes forgave sins, but did He not also say go and sin no more? What for instance would a Priest do if one of his fellow Priests asked for forgiveness, received it, only to go out and do it again? How many times would this go on before the forgiving Priest said enough?

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themurphia | Aug 01, 2011, 06:53 AM EDT
These extract from the Gospels seem to say it all really...'Whosoever shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me,it were bettter that a millstone were hanged around his neck and that he were drowned in the sea'...Matt18.16...not much about 'forgiveness' there...!I'm not usually given to quoting the Bible...amazing what you find in the dusty corners of your memory...!

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Gearoid4 | Jul 31, 2011, 04:34 PM EDT
The Church's motto is "Ecclesia Semper reformanda"(The Church is always in need of reform"). This means in essence means an ability to purify the hearts and minds of both religious and laypeople to make them and by extension the Church closer ever more to Christ's will. The Church, under the present pope is attempting to grapple with the terrible sins that have been committed by those supposedly acting in Her Founder's name, by an ongoing program of spiritual, canonical and procedural reform. @Eiriamach, You blame the Church for encumbering the institute of marriage with too many "rules". Are you referring to Church teachings that state that marriage is for life, between one man and one woman and open to procreation? Maybe you are alluding to the guidelines which relate to the validity of sacramental marriages or those dealing with granting annulments or separations? The Church has not created rules just for their own sake. They are in conformity with the will of Christ to protect the integrity of marriage as a sacred Covenant. The Church during the early centuries was built around monastic settlements and did have practices that were at variance to some degree with those on the continent e.g hair tonsure. But the local church in Ireland was still part of Latin Christendom and there was no rigid conformity regarding liturgical practices as witnessed in the Gallican rite in ancient France or the Mozarbic rite which developed around Milan in northern Italy.

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eiriamach | Jul 31, 2011, 03:54 PM EDT
Worldliness, Aughavey, it's such a drag, isn't it? But the challenge for a Christian, or for anyone who values either a life of the mind or a life of the Spirit, is not to retreat from it and then, from a safe distance and an aloof posture, ceaselessly complain about it, blame it for one's own or priests' failings, and condemn those who try to reform it as "secularists." The challenge is to be in it without being of it, to do one's little bit to transform it, to resist the lure of its materialism, to see the sacred in it, to hear an other-worldly sigh in its human sufferings. Yes, Gearoid4, Jesus warned us not to interfere with marriage, so why does the Church encumber it with so many rules not found in Jesus' words? themurphia, I'd guess (because I'm no historian) that the saints and scholars description goes back in time to when Western Christians were diverse in practice but not in separate sects, and the Irish had monastic practices that were so different from the Roman that they annoyed the Vatican for centuries!

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eiriamach | Jul 31, 2011, 03:22 PM EDT
More triumphalism from tempranillo. "Extra ecclesiam, nulla salus" is infallible dogma? Not recently, not if it refers to the Church in Rome as a way of warning Christians away from other Christian churches. It rather refers to the whole of the faithful, and salvation extends as well to those whom Christianity does not reach. Vatican II corrected the triumphalist, narrow reading of the statement "outside the church, there is no salvation." (As another poster commented, RCC doctrine changes.) If a narrow reading were plausible, then every time a church official has pronounced an excommunication (countless times throughout history), he would be condemning a soul to everlasting damnation, and wouldn't that be a presumptuous thing for a human being to do, to put himself in the role of divine judge and bring down divine judgment on himself? And what about the hapless victims of pedophile priests who, unlistened to, neglected, and often scorned, have committed suicide? Are they burning in the fires of hell also because they fled from a church that claims "outside the church there is no salvation," or will the priests who violated them burn in hell for the despair of these children? As Machiavelli pointed out, it's better to be feared than loved, so when people like Enda Kenny do not express their love for HMC, expect HMC to trot out the doctrines of fear. Whether it's legitimate power or usurped power, power breeds cruelty.

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themurphia | Jul 31, 2011, 03:18 PM EDT
'Prago' eiriamach...Ireland is referred to amongst other things as the 'Land of Saints and Scholars'...As a matter of interest could the term 'Saint' apply to anyone other than the Catholic wing of the Holy Ground...?

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Gearoid4 | Jul 31, 2011, 02:27 PM EDT
You distort my point regarding the claim of the Catholic Church to be the one founded by Jesus Christ. I make a reasonable observation regarding the protestant reformation which even reasonable protestants do not refute i.e it led to thousands of splinter groups which continue to divide even to this day. You quote from the papal document "Ut Unum Sint". This encyclical drawn up by the late Blessed John Paul 11 was a prophetic work looking for the co-operation of fellow Christians to establish the central place of the papacy in uniting christians as the bible warrants. This does not cancel the points made in the papal Declaration "Dominus Iesus"(2000) that the Catholic Church was the one, true Church founded by Christ. One can state this in charity without denigrating the enlightening aspects of Christianity which are found in other Christian communities. Vatican 11 does not downplay the claims of the Catholic church while recognizing the truths found in other Christian churches and ecclesial communities. Good points, Aughavey. I agree fully with your statement that the Catholic Church's lack of transparency and accountability has led to the current travails that she is experiencing

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Gearoid4 | Jul 31, 2011, 02:26 PM EDT
@eiriamach, You stated that Christ taught nothing about sexual morality. This statement is very wide of the mark Consider these direct quotes from Jesus Himself: "You have heard that it was said, 'You shall not commit adultery.' But I say to you that every one who looks at a woman lustfully has already committed adultery with her in his heart."(Matthew 5:27-28) Have you not read that he who made them from the beginning made them male and female, and said, 'For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh'? So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man put asunder."(Matthew 19). Clearly Jesus warned against sexual relations which violated the sacred union of marriage between one man and one woman.

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tempranillo | Jul 31, 2011, 02:23 PM EDT
Of course Bishops would be forgiving to errant priests…Consider the following…From the Papal Bull, Cantate Domino issued by Eugene IV, Pont. Max at The Council of Florence (A.D. 1438-1445)…It firmly believes, professes, and proclaims that those not living within the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics cannot become participants in eternal life, but will depart “into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels” [Matt. 25:41], unless before the end of life the same have been added to the flock; and that the unity of the ecclesiastical body is so strong that only to those remaining in it are the sacraments of the Church of benefit for salvation, and do fastings, almsgiving, and other functions of piety and exercises of Christian service produce eternal reward, and that no one, whatever almsgiving he has practiced, even if he has shed blood for the name of Christ, can be saved, unless he has remained in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church …a rather strong motivator to seek forgiveness & to be forgiven…

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eiriamach | Jul 31, 2011, 02:22 PM EDT
Students not only inspire teachers, themurphia, but teachers learn more from students than any other source! Thanks for the info on Grace O'M.

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themurphia | Jul 31, 2011, 02:17 PM EDT
I've just read that 10,0000 years ago a squirrel could have hopped from one end of Ireland to the other...Don't ask...!That's just NUTS...!

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Aughavey | Jul 31, 2011, 01:00 PM EDT
Gearoid4 says: "People want to Church to conform to their worldly ideals by turning it into a democratized institution where doctrine can be changed at a whim. But this will lead to dissension and schism as the protestant reformation has clearly demonstrated" - I agree with the first part about the people wanting the church to conform to worldliness whereas the church is called to take a stand against worldliness (prodigal son a case in point) and I partially agree regarding schism in the Protestant denominations BUT lack of transparency and unaccountability in the Roman Catholic Church has long been a problem and the worldwide abuse scandals are a case in point.

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Pittsburghkid | Jul 31, 2011, 12:42 PM EDT
Yes, If the Catholic Church would give its blessing to Abortion, then this would be over. Pedophiles seek out professions that give them access to children. This is why, you rarely hear of plumber, electrician, or carpenters being pedophile. Most pedophiles are teacher, clergery, Boy Scout Leaders, day care workers, etc. The problem for the Catholic Church is that the statute of limitation was extended for Priest. This means that case are being brough up from the past fifty years. This makes the problem appear more severe then it actually is.

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themurphia | Jul 31, 2011, 12:21 PM EDT
In a nutshell I guess Granuaile was letting Bess know 'You're not the Boss of me...'!

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themurphia | Jul 31, 2011, 12:15 PM EDT
It seems Grace and Bess were equally matched in linguistic department...and by all accounts conversed in Latin English French and Scots Gaelic as ELizabeth had no Irish...although she apparently commissioned a language testbook in Irish in order no doubt that she would not be outwitted...The offer of the title of Count probably a Courtly pun designed to flatter to deceive was rightly rejected by Granualie who considered them equals...Ditto her refusal to bow thereby refusing to acknowledge Bess as Boss Queen of Ireland...There's my home girl...! Fascinating stuff...only good teachers inspire'students' to learn more about a subject...grma eiriamach

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