NEW YORK BOSTON |#Popular: Irish Celebrity Gossip Irish in US Politics Irish Festivals Irish Roots Irish Entertainment Offbeat Irish

Home Page > Blogs > News blogs > Periscope > Irish divided in their attitudes to emigrants---- Just send the money the message from some

Periscope by Niall O'Dowd

Irish divided in their attitudes to emigrants---- Just send the money the message from some

Posted on Monday, July 04, 2011 at 11:29 PM

Larger Text

E-mail

132 Comments

RSS

Archives

Noreen Bowden has worked on Irish emigrant issues for 20 years and headed up the Irish Emigrant Advice Network at one point for several years .

She understands better than most the ambivalence in Ireland towards emigrants and those who leave the country.

She has just written a thought provoking piece for Journal.ie on this very subject. It makes compelling reading.

Partly it was brought up by my brief run for Irish president where the Irish Times op ed page and several other newspapers questioned whether I had the right to run as an American and Irish dual citizen.

Bowden writes that all is fine as long as emigrants and the Diaspora are sending back money and helping with investment but becoming part of the system or having actual input is not a part of the bargain as far as the Irish are concerned.

She states "When times are tough,... we hear the calls to embrace our renewed status as an emigrant nation. The loudest of these voices tend to belong to those who feel no urge to move themselves’

She notes that "In the 1980s, Brian Lenihan Snr’s “We can’t all live on a small island” seemed to sum up governmental complacency. During the current crisis, it was former Tánaiste Mary Coughlan who highlighted the government’s non-response to rising emigration figures: she claimed young people were emigrating because “they want to enjoy themselves. That’s what young people are entitled to do.”

She is making a point I fully understand.

Talk of emigration being good neatly sidesteps involuntary emigration which is a critical issue right now in Ireland,It is fine for those who want to go abroad, but what about the 50 per cent of young people who are afraid they will have to emigrate just to get a job?

Bowden points out that the Irish leaders like to have their cake and eat it too when it comes to emigrants and the Diaspora.

She writes; "It may have been Mary Robinson who started the celebration of the diaspora in Ireland in the 1990s, but her embrace was soon followed by the phenomenon of diaspora engagement for economic purposes. Irish policy-makers realised we were on to something."

She notes that "The Irish establishment has responded enthusiastically. Former Taoiseach Brian Cowen eagerly talked up the diaspora as a “huge and willing resource” when he launched the Smart Economy strategy in 2010. Enda Kenny was thinking similarly when he announced the initiative in which diaspora members would be paid for job creation. During the crisis, the notion that the diaspora could save us from our financial fate has loomed large. There seems to be no limit to what we can ask of our loyal foot soldiers abroad."

However, Bowden points out that when it came to having an emigrant possibly running for president it became a very different take.

The mentality among some was that ‘He’s not one of us’ she writes.

"There were plenty of voices pointing out that O’Dowd isn’t really one of us any more.

She notes that "The Irish Times ran an unintentionally comical article from the Northern Ireland-born, New York-resident Walter Ellis, who plaintively opined that O’Dowd “would not get my vote”. No surprise there, as Ellis is as disenfranchised as O’Dowd. Irish Times editors thoughtfully appended to the article the text of the US oath of allegiance taken by immigrants when they became US citizens. They did not add that the Irish government does not recognise such oaths as a renunciation of Irish citizenship."

Bowden concludes that " Once you go, your money, your contacts, and your expertise are welcome. Your presence in the political system is not."

That is an interesting finding and one that will hit home with emigrants everywhere. It will be interesting to see how it plays out.

E-mail

132 comments

Next Page 1 of 9 pages

themurphia | Jul 11, 2011, 01:29 PM EDT

All men are created equal but some have more mothers than others...if the cap Fitz wear it...isn't that right Mammy..?

Report abuse

kinvara7 | Jul 11, 2011, 07:46 AM EDT

Thank you casualMBA, you must have been good at drama in school, because your post is quite theatrical (it is a style that many here on IC seem to adopt, I believe the idea is to present oneself as the Shakespearian fool; as if there was method in the madness). Now…exit, pursued by a (polar)bear!

Report abuse

kinvara7 | Jul 11, 2011, 07:17 AM EDT

Report abuse

themurphia | Jul 10, 2011, 05:54 AM EDT

The many headed beast of the hydra stalks these boards...the genetic mutation of some prehistoric creature...manifesting itslf variously as lawyer liar and leprechaun...in reality one undivided self...Do you know who it is yet...work it out...!

Report abuse

casualMBA | Jul 09, 2011, 08:24 PM EDT

(the deLacy brothers having foisted themselves upon Ulster's politics, and, I imagine, in the course of it, leveled their crossbows - true, an inapt cannon - at the O'Neills)

Report abuse

casualMBA | Jul 09, 2011, 08:07 PM EDT

Yikes!! correction! it would be ... Anglo-Irish Ascendancy (or de Lacy) cannons (not canons)...

Report abuse

casualMBA | Jul 09, 2011, 07:32 PM EDT

murphia'malley,..From the field of lepers I am, like the case of blind Rafferty, only a Gall revision of him with his empty pockets, existing not on nettles, I am, but on the stability o f a functional system, charging - into the figurative Valley - the Gael and Anglo-Ascendancy cannons, and living to tell of the "righted" ship.

Report abuse

themurphia | Jul 09, 2011, 04:00 PM EDT

casualMBA:Yes a heart does beat beneath this shield...and I would like it to beat a little longer...I do not want to feel in danger of my life because of death threats posted on a blog by someone cannot take NO for an answer...but yes o'merta from now on...slan a abhaile

Report abuse

themurphia | Jul 09, 2011, 03:44 PM EDT

casualMBA:Glad you liked my 'Polar Birr' story...don't you just think it's just Birrrrrrrilliant...Btw Birr is the coldest place in Ireland so it's only right that the Polarati should hail (hehe)from there...this argument is turning into a bit of a turkey to mix zoological ...well ornithological actually... metaphors...and is in danger of disappearing up it's own Aras...Legislation is not set in stone otherwise we would still send children up chimneys...men could still beat their wives with a stick no thicker than the width of their thumb and women would not have the vote...still no rest for the wigged...let's move on...!First the FitzGeralds now the O'Neills do I take it you are from the fourth Green field casualMBA?

Report abuse

casualMBA | Jul 09, 2011, 12:47 PM EDT

kinvara7, you must have been a fine typist, as well as a thinker, in school...in hopes of my own brevity, I will utilize the vernacular...nominal charges with one's vote?...decidedly a "turn off"...would "diaspora distasteful" convey the meaning?...it will not fly...this dog will not hunt...unless the goal is to bastion one's self as a VERSION of the populace with a protective arm thrown about the plate of political participation...in America, it is a turkey at a hot summer cookout, and not at Thanksgiving...case overstated perhaps, but catch my drift?...on constituencies, take the example of the O'Neills, whose forebears(in this event not polar,)lords, and chieftains have struck for Irish freedom(and Catholicism I might add, though many, not unexpectedly in Northern Ireland, may have changed affiliation since) and their disenfranchisement not only from the Republic but from a political process as theoretically "diaspora" and their entitlement to compensation from a sovereign nation getting its books in order and "righting" its ship of state. Is this in an enfranchisement plan?

Report abuse

kinvara7 | Jul 09, 2011, 08:31 AM EDT

Noreen you are being very selective as regards your comments on the Committe of the Constitution (and perhaps you attach more weight to their recomendations than you should). You should have mentioned that in their conclusion to the issue of emmigrant voting they state that: 'Other aspects of the IEVC’s argument are less convincing, in our view. It makes much of the indivisibility of citizenship, and argues that the entitlement to vote should be treated as an essential aspect of citizenship. But the IEVC itself draws a distinction between Irishborn citizens and others.' Furthermore, and very importantly you omitted the following: 'The IEVC’s argument that a constitutional amendment would not be necessary to extend Dáil votes to emigrants, on the basis that the number of deputies is determined with reference to the population, and not to the number of voters - and that therefore the number of voters on the roll in any given constituency is immaterial in framing constituency boundaries - is certainly sustainable on a straightforward reading of the text. In our view, HOWEVER, the alternative interpretation is also possible, in that one could argue that the maintenance of constituencies with substantially differing ratios of electors to deputies would run contrary to the intent of the framers of the Constitution and to the strongly territorial basis of our electoral system' [emphasis added]. In my 'learned' opinion the later argument is correct, and has been considered so by a former Atorney General. The conclusion of the report was that: 'The right to vote in Dáil elections should remain confined to citizens ordinarily resident in the state, and to such other classes of resident as are determined by law.'

Report abuse

kinvara7 | Jul 09, 2011, 07:09 AM EDT

Noreen: You can call my ideas dumb if you want; good manners are a matter for yourself. You say that you are neutral about the tax issue, but Noreen, let's be honest you clearly are not neutral; you have spoken against it elsewhere. Therefore I think you're being disingenuous in that regard. Could you explain how requiring non-resident citizens (who can) to contribute a small nominal amount in return for postal voting would be 'impractical and costly'? Another weak argument, because the complete opposite is the truth. Furthermore, goodwill and responsibility are different concepts. When one does something that they have no duty or responsibility to do, that is goodwill. Citizens have responsibilities; good citizens also extend goodwill. Indeed your list of 'goodwill' acts, ignores important facts (such as Ireland's investment in the US and our low corporate tax rate) and I have already discussed those issues below. Your version of our Republic is flawed. You seek the maximum amount of rights, for the least amount of contribution (zero it would appear). For how long could a Republic survive if it kept running such 'democratic deficits'? You say that you are in favour of citizens living up to their responsibilities, yet the only responsibility you mention is voting. What other responsibilities do you think citizens should 'live up to'? Or is voting the only one?

Report abuse

casualMBA | Jul 08, 2011, 06:42 PM EDT

beneath that shield, o'mearta, there is a heart...now shhh yourself on Ireland's persecuted IT

Report abuse

themurphia | Jul 08, 2011, 04:13 PM EDT

Actually threatening commenters seems to be a trait amongst IT writers..Ellis threatened George if I remeber correctly...maybe it's part of the IT hack job description/person specification to have an unpleasant disposition...?

Report abuse

themurphia | Jul 08, 2011, 03:37 PM EDT

Returning to my friend Ursus maritimus hibernicus...if hIS great great great great great great great great grandfather came from Offaly...he might be of the genus Polar Birrrrrr...!Guess it's true what they say there's only two types of people the Irish and those who wish they were...even birrrrs...!

Report abuse

Next Page 1 of 9 pages