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Home Page > Blogs > News blogs > Periscope > Contraception controversy overshadows amazing work of Catholic hospitals --- Vital part of US healthcare in every state

Periscope by Niall O'Dowd

Contraception controversy overshadows amazing work of Catholic hospitals --- Vital part of US healthcare in every state

Posted on Friday, February 24, 2012 at 03:12 PM

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BishopSean | Mar 02, 2012, 11:29 AM EST

Hi, @Eiriamach. Thanks for continuing with the thread. “ought entails can”— We have long been living and working by choice in poor and LDCs (Least Developed) Countries and poor women here frequently do not see abortion as a moral choice, even when legal. In his book ABORTED WOMEN; SILENT NO MORE, social scientist David Reardon worked with WEBA (Women Exploited by Abortion). His book details attitudes of hundreds of aborted women and shows that dissatisfaction and regrets over abortion grow with time. One big discovery is that the majority of women did not experience the abortion as a choice at all. 83% of women surveyed indicated they would definitely have chosen against abortion if their husbands or boyfriends, abortion counselors, doctors and family members had suggested and encouraged alternatives. 55% said they had been “very much forced by others” to abort. Furthermore, 75% said they would not have sought an abortion if it had been illegal. (to be followed).

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eiriamach | Mar 01, 2012, 10:35 AM EST

Bishop Sean, it would be a mistake to assume that all women who have abortions have adopted a "moral relativism" perspective in their lives. Far from it! The statistics that show the abortion rate increasing among poor women and also show the majority of abortion clients already have families reveal the desperation of women who literally CANNOT care for another child and who may not have financial access to effective birth control. It is a time-honored maxim of ethics-- and common sense-- that "ought entails can": if a woman *cannot* financially provide the means and time that child rearing requires, then it makes no sense at all, in fact it's cynical, to argue that she *ought* to do so. What we physically or financially cannot do, we have no moral obligation to try to do. Those who oppose abortion on "moral" grounds must begin to take seriously the principled reasons most women have when they choose abortion. That would mean getting serious about economic inequality and other such political issues, rather than just brushing aside the seriousness of such a decision with a catchphrase like "moral relativism." That would mean having respect for the moral sensitivity of women (and the parents of pregnant children) confronting the choice of abortion.

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BishopSean | Mar 01, 2012, 10:04 AM EST

Dear @Eiriamach, I stand corrected on my earlier statement that abortions are now higher than ever in the USA. The latest Guttmacher Institute statistics (2008 data) show that there were 1.21 million abortions in 2008 and a rate of 19.6 abortions per 1,000 women aged 15-44. These figures are up from 2005 survey stats but down from 1990 figures which peaked at 1.6 million and the abortion rate was 27.4. Still appalling. They are over 30 in urban states Delaware, New York and New Jersey. Cumulatively, there have been 55 million abortions in USA since 1974, 3,767 per day. Now that early medication abortion is more available, there’s an increase—from 161,000 to 199,000 between 2005 and 2008, accounting for 17% of abortions. Guttmacher’s Rachel Jones expects this trend to accelerate. Where State Governments are more permissive, there are more abortions. Secular humanist thinking produces moral relativism so what is legal is moral, making Government the final decider of morality. Scary.

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eiriamach | Feb 29, 2012, 11:32 PM EST

The women "simply got careless," Bishop Sean, or were they using less effective, failure-prone methods such as NFP? The US abortion rate has been steadily decreasing since 1997 and remains stable now. Thirty-five years after Roe vs. Wade, the US had fewer abortions, despite population growth (in 2008, the last year of available data: 825,564). Sixty per cent of women having abortions are already mothers; the proportion of poor women having abortions, however, has dramatically increased. NPR reported on "Abortion in the United States: Incidence and Access to Services, 2005," by Rachel K. Jones, Zolna, Henshaw, Finer: "[T]he abortion rate in 2005 was lower than the rate in 1975, two years after Roe v. Wade.... In 2005 we had an abortion rate of 19.4 per 1,000 women aged 15 to 44," said Rachel Jones, a senior research associate with the group and the study's lead author. That's down 'considerably' from a high point of 29.3 abortions per 1,000 women in 1980.... In 2005, there were 1.2 million abortions in the U.S., down 8 percent from 1.3 million in 2000." These statistics include RU-486 abortions. IF it is true that Planned Parenthood performs more abortions now, that fact is surely due to the closure of many local clinics and the fact that PP has a nation-wide network of clinics. About 84 counties, containing one-third the female population, have no provider.

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jpf | Feb 29, 2012, 09:30 PM EST

Catholic hospitals employ more than 525,193 full-time employees and 233,394 part-time workers. More reason why contraception SHOULD BE COVERED. Its just not right to claim to help but only if you believe like a Catholic. Providing care or employment does not mean the employer decides what someone should use for their family life.

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BishopSean | Feb 29, 2012, 05:33 PM EST

If I might follow one statement (out of context) by Eiriamach:“...The ridiculous premise is that only a woman who would abort a pregnancy would support birth control. How illogical can they get before they become completely laughable?”—I would like to respond. Obviously, there are many men and women who agree that using contraceptives is moral, who do not maintain that abortion is moral. However, there are statistics available from the CDC that most women who have aborted in the USA had in fact been using other contraceptive methods prior to their abortions and simply got careless, etc. If PP’s goal of making more (non-abortifacient) contraceptives available is to decrease the need for abortions, why is the rate of abortions increasing over time, rather than decreasing, especially in their Centers (they’re the US’s largest provider of abortions) and elsewhere in the USA? What is wrong with this picture?

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ciaradexy | Feb 29, 2012, 08:07 AM EST

Howareya-I work in a maternity hospital so I meet these women with cancer and other medical issues who cannot terminate their pregnancy here. This is pro-foetus, anti-women. Some women do not want children so they have options when they get pregnant-go ahead with it or terminate it. This is up to their conscience not yours. Im not bitter, Im not judging women. They have a right to chose to be more than just an incubator.

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BishopSean | Feb 29, 2012, 06:26 AM EST

I wpuld like to than @howareya for her personal testimony which is based on right reasoning and is from the heart. You have done a good thing, @howareya, and should not be surprised at some responses that are designed to generate more heat than light. "Every good deed is its own...punishment," said Claire Booth Luce--but she went on to say we have to do the good deeds anyway.

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IrelandNorth | Feb 29, 2012, 06:15 AM EST

The Holy Roman Catholic and Apostolic Church preaches the Billings Method of 'coitus interruptus' (a sort of Irish white-tantra) as its form of immaculate con[tra]ception[?]. As an ex-psychoanalytic counsellor with ACCORD: Catholic Marriage Care Service (CMCS) here in Dublin, Ireland, I can vouch that they are very progressive in their paradigm. Psycho[anal]ytically, homosexuality is considered an inverse sexuality, (i.e. turned inwards) due to over-identification with same sex parents. Freud considered it a sexual perversity, though only in the sense of being incomplete.

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IrelandNorth | Feb 28, 2012, 09:36 PM EST

ciaradexy, I agree completely with you - and for good reason. I lived and worked In San Francisco for more than 20 years. Through my work, initially, I came to know many gays and a few lesbians. A good many were friends that I worked with day in and day out (our company was the largest international banking and financial services organization in the world), had dinner with them, visited their homes and, sadly, attended too many funerals. Without a single exception, they told me the same thing, that they knew from a very early age that they were different, not like other children in fundamental ways. I learned how confusing and frightening this was and always the compelling need to keep these feelings secret. To hear people say that homosexuality is a lifestyle choice, that it can be cured with hand-holding and prayer betrays a level of ignorance that I truly believed could not exist in the human mind in the 21st century A.D. Eiriamach, your posts are always beautifully articulate, intelligent, humane, moderate and amongst the very best offered on this website.

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eiriamach | Feb 28, 2012, 05:32 PM EST

I'm one of many whose tax money supports Catholic hospitals and agencies through federal and state "faith-based" program funding. That fact makes it imperative that we speak out when religion-affiliated institutions that take public funding refuse to provide equal health care insurance for their female employees. So no, @Madeliene, I will not keep my opinion to myself. This is very much a public issue. I not surprised that the people who demand their own "religious liberty" to discriminate against women try to silence those who disagree with them.

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Madeliene | Feb 28, 2012, 03:37 PM EST

Birtif you do not wish to become pregnant buy your own- if you do not want a child do not have it but keep your opinipons to yourself and your God- and not impose the opinions or the price of your contaceptives on others!h conrol has been around for a lot of years

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eiriamach | Feb 28, 2012, 01:33 PM EST

BTW, let's not for a moment believe that howareya is female. This creature is just another screen name for the reactionary RCC defenders on IC (whatever happened to angelprecious et al?). A woman would not write, "But, unfortunately, you can't..you are the ones that get pregnant!" Every once in a while, these men slip up this way, and their identity becomes obvious.

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eiriamach | Feb 28, 2012, 01:25 PM EST

No, howareya and Bishop Sean are both wrong, and both grossly misrepresent the issue AGAIN. The current debate is about CONTRACEPTION, not abortion. Howareya, I'm sorry you did not have either the sense of responsibility or the financial means to use contraceptives when you should have. So you're happy with how your accidental pregnancy turned out, good for you. I hope your accidental daughter has the wisdom and the moral sense to take responsibility for her childbearing. She certainly does not have a role model for morality in her mother. A role model for moral responsibility would fight for her daughter's equal rights to employment, to self-sufficiency, and to equal health care. She would never allow men to impose a subordinate status or mindless obedience on her daughter or on herself.

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howareya | Feb 28, 2012, 12:50 PM EST

"Gearoid, youre not female. You will never know what it is like to be pregnant with a potential baby you do not want therefore you will never ever have the options. You will never have to make the decision. You will never have to be faced with carrying a pregnancy or having to push a baby out of your body so until you do, you will never understand" Well, ciaradexy, I am female and I did get pregnant at a time that was difficult. I chose to take responsibility for my actions and have my baby. She is 39 now and been a great joy to me. I am sorry, but women need to realize they have more responsiblity than men when it comes to sex. They are the ones that get pregnant. They can't walk away from the situation. Sadly, with the sexual revolution, some women feel that they should have the same rights as men. But, unfortunately, you can't..you are the ones that get pregnant! I have known women who used abortion as a form of birth control...oops pregnant again...gotta get rid of it, not convenient for me now. Our society is breaking down because women are being told their babies are just a bunch of cells. Ever notice when a baby is planned or wanted, it's a baby from the time it is conceived. But if it's not wanted it's just a glob. ciaradexy, I feel sorry for you, you always sound so bitter in your comments.

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