112 Comments

• STEVENSTAR | Feb 13, 2013, 07:12 PM EST

  AMERICANS ARE YEARS BEHIND US IN IRELAND WHEN IT COMES TO GAY MARRIAGE ETC .. MOST PEOPLE IN IRELAND INCLUDING MYSELF SUPPORT GAY MARRIAGE ... AND THIS IS ANOTHER REASON WHY AMERICANS WHO THINK THEY ARE IRISH ARE SO CULTURALLY AND PERSONALITY WISE SO DIFFERENT TO US IRISH... I PITY ANY GAY PERSON LIVING IN AMERICA ITS OK TO CARRY GUNS AND WALK AROUND AND SHOOT PEOPLE BUT TO BE GAY IN AMERICA ITS LIKE A SIN .. YOUR A SECOND CLASS CITIZEN .. SAD BUT TRUE....ANYWAYS THATS THEIR PROBLEM NOT OURS !!!

• Seanmor | Oct 13, 2012, 12:43 PM EDT

  Obama's support of same-sex marriages doesn't go far enough. In order to give homosexuals a wider range of choices when selecting a partner, the age of concent for teenaged homosexuals should be lowered from 18 to 16 or even 15.

• hollabackgurl | Jun 03, 2012, 04:54 PM EDT

  What's the Defense of Marriage Act (DOMA) if not a government working against the rights of the individual? Your bombastic statements never make any sense BRIANO.

• BrianO | May 15, 2012, 07:21 PM EDT

  first off the polygamy comment was not mine. the far left seeks a socialistic form of government working from the top down wherein the freedom of the individual is compromised for the supposed good of the collective group.

• GregShox | May 14, 2012, 03:49 PM EDT

  BrianO -- In order to avoid confusion, and so that we all agree on what we're talking about, could you please explain what you mean by the far left? What is it?

• eiriamach | May 14, 2012, 12:58 PM EDT

  BrianO, I forgot to mention the threat that polygamy poses to separation of church and state: "The cost to governments of trying to dismantle the FLDS theocracy has been extraordinary.... Arizona and Utah have spent millions of dollars in the past three years attempting to regain secular control of town councils, police departments, schools, and private property seized by the FLDS in Hildale, Utah, and adjoining Colorado City, Arizona. The effort has had mixed success, with polygamists still firmly in control of the town councils and the police force that the two towns share." Also "The U.S. Supreme Court ruled in the landmark Reynolds case in 1878 'that plural marriages shall not be allowed.' Regarding Reynolds' argument that he should not be charged with bigamy in the Utah Territory after taking a second wife, the Supreme Court ruled that laws prohibiting polygamy cannot be ignored simply because polygamy is a religious belief" (Phoenix New Times, Oct 4, 2007). Religion does not trump the common (moral) good, even when the bible clearly supports polygamy.

• eiriamach | May 14, 2012, 12:44 PM EDT

  BrianO, how does support for same-sex marriage "reduce individual freedoms"? 'Seems to me, it leaves the individual more free. In reply to your question about polygamy, you can research Warren Jeffs and the Fundamentalist Church of Latter Day Saints, which has practiced polygamy in recent years (Arizona, Utah) and created a hornet's nest of problems, for example, pedophilia and under-age marriages of girls, withholding of education from girls, rape of minors, and driving out of the "surplus" teenaged men that communities have when male leaders are "rewarded" with three or more wives. Considering how much we currently know of the harm done by polygamy, the Supreme Court is not at all like to reverse its 19th century ruling against it.

• BrianO | May 14, 2012, 09:12 AM EDT

  For the hopeful open minded idealists, beware, as you are being recruited by the far left. use reason and regard all comments on this site as propaganda, The left uses situations to reduce individual freedoms.

• BrianO | May 13, 2012, 11:36 PM EDT

  i want to know from the people who support gay marriage, what then is the legitimate argument against polygamy?

• timbobdennehy | May 12, 2012, 08:04 PM EDT

  you should never mix religion,family,and politics,in any order.Would'nt it be great if the United states of AmericA,were a nation of neutral,unbiased people,we can only dream.

• GregShox | May 12, 2012, 06:31 PM EDT

  Peterson, the bible says lots of things. For example, it says that handicapped people may ust not approach the altar. And it says that women during menstruation are unclean. It also explains how you must beat a slave woman after you have sex with her. I guess you're just cherry-picking the bits that suit your own personal dislikes, right? Laws of God? Please.

• peterson | May 12, 2012, 05:04 PM EDT

  What does the Bible say about gays ?? Many many of us go by the laws of God !!

• GregShox | May 12, 2012, 02:32 PM EDT

  IrelandNorth - Would you prevent post-menopausal women from marrying?

• eiriamach | May 12, 2012, 11:01 AM EDT

  "If the purpose of marriage is procreation," but the purpose of marriage is obviously NOT procreation. People can procreate without marriage, and many married couples don't procreate. Try an experiment of the imagination, just to see how tyrannical your position is, IrelandN: Imagine a county clerk requiring that you and your fiancee submit proof that you can and will procreate as often as the law demands. If you cannot or refuse to submit that evidence, the clerk will refuse to issue you a marriage license. Now isn't that ridiculous? The state has an interest in marriage in part because it has an interest in children growing up in stable environments. But heterosexual marriage has a 50% divorce rate, not just among childless or empty-nest couples, so limiting marriage to opposite-sex couples does not fulfill that purpose. And lesbian and gay couples also raise children. Marriage is about intimate relationships as well as family. There are no excuses for excluding anyone on the basis of "procreation."

• IrelandNorth | May 12, 2012, 08:09 AM EDT

  Same sex marriages are oxymoronic. If the purpose of marriage is procreation - a biological impossibility for same sexers, what's the frickin' point. Furthermore, not all homosexuals are gay. Many are quite depressed. Contrary to what genital narcissists might think, the cosmos doesn't revolve around their silly little willies.

• GregShox | May 12, 2012, 06:07 AM EDT

  Murph46 You ask who I am. What exactly do you mean by that? you seem to be questioning my right to take part in this discussion.

• EphraimKibbey | May 11, 2012, 11:46 PM EDT

  @IrishAndProud - Evolution is an ongoing process and we are all at different points on the road to enlightenment. I do not doubt that the President will continue to evolve and I fully support him on his journey. Join us, please!

• BrianO | May 11, 2012, 09:34 PM EDT

  So Cahir Am I gay or am I straight? do you know ephraim, mamaginnity, hollaback?

• mamaginnty | May 11, 2012, 06:03 PM EDT

  I admire Cahir for printing the truth and I admire Obama as well. I may be the oldest person on this site, I am Irish and live in Ireland. Years ago we had certain types who beat a gay person, stupid people. We have excepted people who are gay, I actually hate the word gay, maybe it is because we are a small country, with so many small villages, your best friend came out and finally told you they were gay, people you played with as a child, grew up with, you knew they were " different " but it did not matter, you loved them then...you love them now. Ireland has excepted them and why not, god made them. Over the years I have met so many of these beautiful genuine people, seen their love for one another, and it broke my heart to see what they were living through. Years ago I did see what Cahir mentioned, parents ashamed, pushing their child away, disowning them as they got older, brothers beating them. it did happen. Those same brothers get married the so called correct way and beat their wives and maybe the children, what gives them the right, is it because that little bit of mainly religious paper gives them the right. Religion itself has cause so many wars world wide. In Ireland we lived it. America is a messed up country, to many states, with to many different laws, and causing each group/state to hate the other. Go out and meet these different people whether gay, black or white..white, the so called intelligent superior animal on this planet, tis no wonder god makes us burn.

• MrSinatra | May 11, 2012, 10:38 AM EDT

  Proud Canadian, you aren't worth speaking to. i try to address the merits, you meanwhile are nothing more than a demagogue and race baiter. you are proof that when the left can't win on the merits, you hurtle invective and epitaphs.
  
  mouse, i will respond to you, b/c you are civil. i absolutely believe there is a valid argument to be made for, and against, saying gays should be federally treated as a "protected class." but don't conflate that with gay marriage, b/c even if they were, that doesn't confer such desired rights.
  
  as to the other issue, LOTS of things are necessary in health care, and much more important for people to be able to live at all, indeed survive, than birth control, which is not medicene or treatment for a disease. should men get free condoms from their insurance? the whole thing is insane. if you agree gov't should not be involved AT ALL in health care, join me, my side. what i propose is that gov't get out of telling companies what to do, and let them compete. plans with more and better coverage WILL win out, as long as you are willing to pay for them. thats the free market.
  
  but the bigger point is that its insane and ridiculous to say that b/c a politician doesn't believe the gov't has a role to play in telling insurance companies what to pay for, or not, they then are conducting a "war on women." don't fall for such CHEAP and LAME come ons. its leftist jingoism.

• DLW12183 | May 11, 2012, 10:00 AM EDT

  This article insults the intelligence of Irish Central's subscribers. Clearly a far left wing editorial. This publication is becoming a joke with contributors like Cahir. Marriage and divorce are state issues, not federal, unless Obuma through his Chicago politics decides to change the Civil Rights Act. Again, more government intrusion in our day to day life. By the way, I'm not against gay marriage, just the federal government control and intrusion into my life.

• BippyBellito | May 11, 2012, 08:24 AM EDT

  If you like Obama, this decision is a Crowning Point in a Failed Presidency. If you do not trust Obama, (I am one of those), this was a very easy pander. He's not going to do anything to dictate the law. He just saw the $$$$ from the Gay Community flowing his way. We of Irish heritage can get sentimental and weepy over certain visceral issues important to us. Do not be fooled by this Evil President.

• IrishAndProud | May 11, 2012, 03:30 AM EDT

  And also, Mousemess...what do you mean, Obama's 'already ahead in electoral votes?' Not a single vote's been cast, yet! If you mean he happens to be 'ahead' in certain states, you're basing that on very fluid polls, very early on. My goodness, Reagan was even with or BEHIND Jimmy Carter, just weeks before the 1980 election, and Reagan won in a landslide. Bush 41 was riding 90% or more approval ratings in 1991, and yet lost to Clinton the very next year. So now you're going to say that just because Obama's barely ahead in CERTAIN polls with only REGISTERED voters being polled, and because that COLLECTIVELY APPEARS to give him an electoral edge (which has NEVER been accurate, this far out) that he's flatly 'going to win'? You're not basing that on very stable numbers, kiddo.

• IrishAndProud | May 11, 2012, 03:19 AM EDT

  Here's a gay publication that is not at ALL happy with what Barack Obama has done: it's stonezone-dot-com. Also, Mousemess, you're right that the votes of homosexuals (many of whom are conservatives, btw, and will not necessarily vote for Obama) won't be needed...because the landslide heading Obama's way this November could be quite substantial. Not only does he obviously not have the GOP vote (not significant by itself -- except that in voter registration Repubs outnumber Democrats and are much more interested and enthusiastic than Democrats), but Obama is also WAY behind Romney with the independent vote (people like myself)...and that is political death. Consider also that in every poll which gives Obama and 'edge,' they come from A) left wing sources that B) oversample Democrats and/or C) poll only registered voters, because it's easier...and as any pollster worth their salt will tell you, there's an enormous difference between registered and LIKELY voters, where it's much closer...and we're not even at JUNE, yet!

• Mousemess | May 11, 2012, 03:09 AM EDT

  Borefield, Obama doesn't need the votes. He is already ahead of Romney in electoral votes and he has millions of votes he can count on November 6th (the USA's general election day for president,congresspersons, local and state officials and ballot questions) and will have even more as people come to understand that Romney is not the right person for the USA president for many reasons totally unrelated to his faith.

• Mousemess | May 11, 2012, 02:57 AM EDT

  Alise, Thanks for pointing out the disparities between how straights and gays are treated in different ways. Mr, Sinatra, While it's true that it's now illegal to in most of the US Northeastern states including Maryland where I live to fire and not hire people for being gay, to deny people with good paying history, good credit and good jobs rental housing or home purchase solely on the basis of being gay and to deny them public accommodations in hotels and B Bs just for being gay, unfortunately in so much of the USA that kind of discrimination in jobs, housing and public accommodations still exists and has no place in a modern, advanced Western democracy such as the USA.

• Mousemess | May 11, 2012, 02:42 AM EDT

  Mr. Sinatra, of the subject you addressed me on: When US Congressmen and Congresswoman can pass laws that give employers the right to decide whether they want mammograms and other vitally important and potentially life-saving female health care procedures to be covered (there is sir a big difference between choosing between a bag of lettuce and of spinach at the grocery store and the health and lives of company employees also know as human beings I hope you know) This should be between the woman and her doctor or on vital life-saving men's health between a man and his doctor and not between an employer and their employees. Congress should NOT be involved in this but unfortunately the facts of the case is that Congress is involved like ir or not. I pay close attention to my country's issues, that's how I know about this.

• IrishAndProud | May 11, 2012, 12:47 AM EDT

  Ephraim, you are making utterly NO sense, here. In one sentence, you say you're 'proud' to support Barack Obama, and yet in the very next sentence boast how courts are overruling the will of the states, where Obama said it should be left. Which is it, kiddo?

• EphraimKibbey | May 11, 2012, 12:38 AM EDT

  I am proud to support President Obama. His statement of PERSONAL belief was historic in that it was the first time a sitting American President has taken this stand. It is one more step toward an America that lives up to the promises of her founder's words. California's Proposition Eight has been declared unconstitutional by the Federal Courts and the two lawyers that fought Bush v. Gore in front of the Supreme court are combining forces (one TRUE conservative and one liberal) to proclaim its unconstitutionality there as well. State marriage laws have come before the supreme court four times in the past and a person's right to marry the person of their chosing has always been upheld. All of the similar state laws will likewise be found unconstitutional. When the dust clears marriage equality will be rightfully recognised as an inalienable right (pursuit of happiness) and in thirty or forty years people will not be able to recall what the fuss was all about. The universe bends toward justice - MLK.

• IrishAndProud | May 11, 2012, 12:14 AM EDT

  What, exactly, has Obama accomplished, here...other than stating opinions? What law has been accomplished, what opinions nationwide have been changed? Everyone, pro or con, knew he felt this way on this issue, already.

• BrianO | May 10, 2012, 11:48 PM EDT

  Please political courage? Really. Obama is a cold calculating politician, if you are a supporter of the weather underground I could understand supporting Obama, if you were a leader of black theology church I could understand supporting Obama, if you are in favor of social engineering I could understand supporting Obama. If you love freedom I could not imagine supporting this cold hearted man. If you are gay and don't have freedom you have to fear for more than the access to marriage.

• patrickesq | May 10, 2012, 09:50 PM EDT

  I too applaud what the President did because he is on the leading edge of civil rights. It certainly was not a ploy to get more votes on the same day that North Carolinian voters amended their Constitution to ban homosexual marriages. But the South has always been a leader in opposing civil rights, i.e., Jim Crow laws and forbidding interracial marriages. Marriage is more symbolic of a commitment to a loving relationship, as much as a legal relationship. All people should be able to publicly declare their commitment and receive the same treatment from the government as any other committed couple. Religious organizations are still free to determine for their members who is eligible for their concept of marriage!

• CelticQueenUSA | May 10, 2012, 09:49 PM EDT

  I think it is great that people believe in the freedom to love whoever you love with no judgements from the heteros. I am proud of Barack's stance as well as Biden. Homophobics get into YOUR closet!

• christilcaugh | May 10, 2012, 09:15 PM EDT

  I too am thankful to hear him acknowledge this. It's a big step in the right direction.

• ProudCanadian | May 10, 2012, 08:04 PM EDT

  Mr. Sinatra now that isn't nice bringing in the race card on this. Don't tell me that you are a racist to. You've got problems.

• ProudCanadian | May 10, 2012, 08:00 PM EDT

  Murph who is telling you who to marry? There is nothing in this article that says anyone is telling you who to marry. I don't know why hetrosexuals like yourself are so parinoid.

• ProudCanadian | May 10, 2012, 07:57 PM EDT

  Mr. Sinatra in other words as long as people do what you and the so-called masses think then the other people should shut there mouths. You people down there spout liberty and freedom just as long as it is your liberty and freedom, I don't see your logic. A gay man or wonen is not free to marry who they like so how can they have the same liberty and freedom in that case that you have.

• hollabackgurl | May 10, 2012, 07:54 PM EDT

  He already had their votes. If you are incapable of seeing his political courage trust me your grand kids can.

• peterson | May 10, 2012, 07:44 PM EDT

  In the past he has publicly stated several time publicly that he was against gay marriages. I guess he wants their votes.

• Murph46 | May 10, 2012, 07:16 PM EDT

  Greg Shox -I don't give a damn what people do,no one is telling me who to marry -but the last i looked (and took up arms for) I have a right to believe what I want.Who are you ?

• Murph46 | May 10, 2012, 07:12 PM EDT

  I missed your question Greg Sox what was it?

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 07:07 PM EDT

  Proud Canadian, whats not to get? honestly, maybe you need help? rights have nothing to do with what someone wants, nothing. how many times do i have to say that? its a question of the same standard being applied to all, and it is.
  
  its interesting how when a white vice president says he is in favor of states rights deciding the issue, he's the anti-christ, but when a black president says the SAME EXACT THING, he's delivering the gospel of the lord our father!

• ProudCanadian | May 10, 2012, 06:55 PM EDT

  Oh and Murph I am a true Canadian and very proud of it. I thank God that I am not an American because your country is in one huge mess thanks to George Warmunger Bush and his criminal friends who by the way made the Mafia look like they were Alter boys. Good luck with digging yourselves out of that hole.

• STEVENSTAR | May 10, 2012, 06:52 PM EDT

  OBAMA IS IRISH NOW TOO ? HAHA! I WONDER IF THEY'RE ACTUALLY ANY AMERICANS LEFT OVER IN AMERICA THESE DAYS OR ARE THEY ALL IRISH... OBAMA IS AS IRISH TO US AS IM FROM OUT SPACE ... PLEASE !! WHAT SOME GREAT GREAT GRANNY OF HIS CAME FROM MONEYGALL A VILLAGE IN MIDDLE OF NOWHERE... THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM IRISH ... AS FOR GAY MARRIAGE ITS ABOUT TIME AMERICA CAUSGHT UP WITH THE REST OF THE WORLD...

• raoulwine | May 10, 2012, 06:51 PM EDT

  HOLD your horses folks. He said He endorsed the concept, period, but then said it was a states right decision. It has been passed in NO state failing every ballot opportunity, Thus it was cheap talk, that means nothing and changes nothing. A vapid attempt to gain support by doing nothing.

• ProudCanadian | May 10, 2012, 06:50 PM EDT

  Mr. Sinatra I don't get you laogic. The gays don't have the same rights because they can't marry who they want to they have to marry who we say they can. Think before you print your dribble, are you sure you an not Murph.

• kaydog1 | May 10, 2012, 06:49 PM EDT

  "historic moment?" "Not another cheap political calculation?" "transformative Presidency?" ...please stop 'tingling' and 'chilling' for just a minute. Listen, Obama was AGAINST gay marriage in 2008 when it was politically expedient to get Black Church support. Then, during his 1st two years as President, Obama controlled the House, Senate, and Presidency, and could have rammed through ANY "transformative" legislation he cared to. Did he repay gay support by pushing to legalize gay marriage? He did NOT. Neither did he reward Hispanics by legalizing Illegals, nor reward Blacks by pushing for reparations. Instead, Obama looked after the Insurance Companies by requiring you to PURCHASE Obamacare health insurance, looked after Banks and Wall Street with more bailouts, looked after Unions with "stimulus money" sent to keep big-city union employees on the roster and with half-ownership of GM, etc. At this time there is not even a Bill on the table for gay marriage, and Obama's support now is just induce you to send him more cash - you will get NOTHING tangible out of him on this. But sure, Cahir, send President Incredible ALL of your money if you like - just quit drooling on my screen, okay?

• ProudCanadian | May 10, 2012, 06:45 PM EDT

  Ah Murph settle down, I actually have two dogs and who by the way is telling you how to live? Isn't it us straight people telling the Gays how to live and not to live? I think that your paranoia is getting the best of you mate. Why don't you answer GregSox question. I'd be real interested to hear it, come on murph and spout off tell us.

• STEVENSTAR | May 10, 2012, 06:41 PM EDT

  OBAMA IS IRISH NOW TOO ? HAHA! I WONDER IF THEY'RE ACTUALLY ANY AMERICANS LEFT OVER IN AMERICA THESE DAYS OR ARE THEY ALL IRISH... OBAMA IS AS IRISH TO US AS IM FROM OUT SPACE ... PLEASE !! WHAT SOME GREAT GREAT GRANNY OF HIS CAME FROM MONEYGALL A VILLAGE IN MIDDLE OF NOWHERE... THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM IRISH ... AS FOR GAY MARRIAGE ITS ABOUT TIME AMERICA CAUSGHT UP WITH THE REST OF THE WORLD...

• GregShox | May 10, 2012, 06:15 PM EDT

  Murph46 -- You seem to have overlooked my question. Would you mind answering it?

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 06:11 PM EDT

  excuse my typo, this:
  
  ...what someone WANTS and NO BEARING WHATSOEVER...
  
  should have said this:
  
  ...what someone WANTS has NO BEARING WHATSOEVER...

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 06:04 PM EDT

  also, Gays are not a "protected class." its a legal term, look it up if you don't know the meaning. now, they may be one day, you may want them to be, but that doesn't make it so.
  
  and again, for the people who shout and don't listen, one last time, what someone WANTS and NO BEARING WHATSOEVER on what RIGHTS they have or don't have. Gays have EXACTLY the same rights as straights, EXACTLY. straights can marry someone of the opposite sex, so can gays. whats not to get?

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 06:01 PM EDT

  i love how the left, when it hears what it doesn't like, resorts to calling people racists and bigots. grow up.

• Bythebay | May 10, 2012, 05:48 PM EDT

  Obama's statement changes nothing, has no legal effect. Might get him some more re-election money from the gay and lesbian community which is probably why he said it.

• ProudCanadian | May 10, 2012, 05:36 PM EDT

  It is says after every post report abuse I think we should report Mr Sinatra and Murph 46. Just kidding. Everyone is intitle to their opinions. Gregshox I am sorry to say that you will probably never get an answer to your question because there probably isn't one. People read the bible and interpret it to their own satisfaction but the problem is they don't read it all.

• ProudCanadian | May 10, 2012, 05:26 PM EDT

  What a great and courages man President Obama is. Please I implore the American people to do the right thing and put this great man in for another term, for the worlds sake

• Eschetic | May 10, 2012, 05:26 PM EDT

  'Sorry to weigh in a second time on this topic (issues are always "controversial" when so-called conservatives know they're losing), but *reasonable* people need to watch what the no-nothings and bigots put out there; the "Swiftboating" campaign tactics of knowing lies from the "Right" are only effective if we let them be. Case in point: IrishAndProud posted earlier today (May 10, 2012, at 02:26 PM EDT that Equal marriage rights for gays had been rejected every time they had been submitted to U.S. voters. Even if you allow that basic human rights SHOULD be subject to majority vote (and no one who thinks the correct side won WWII should accept that), the assertion is simply not true. In Connecticut, following the state Supreme Court properly interpreting the State marriage law as not requiring the parties to a marriage be of opposite sexes (an argument I won with my Town Clerk almost 30 years ago, persuading her to issue a marriage license to a gay couple who were clients of mine - they chose not to go forward at the time because the next step would have been fighting the Reagan era IRS), the decision was specifically AFFIRMED at the polls in the next election. Occasionally the voters get it right - as they will when the bigots are rejected this coming November.

• alisaann | May 10, 2012, 04:59 PM EDT

  we see what allowing each state to deicde does....NOW, even straight couples in NORTH CAROLINA can't even enter into "civil unions" or "domestic partnerships"....the ban that was vote on by the people of that state, HURTS MORE THEN GAYS.....it should be FEDERAL LAW, allowing ALL PEOPLE THE RIGHT TO MARRY...and EVERY state has to recgonize the marriages.

• alisaann | May 10, 2012, 04:54 PM EDT

  Mr.Sinatra: gay people DON'T want to marry someone of the opposite sex....they want to be able to marry their OWN GENDER....why should have to live a lie, just to make closed-minded BIGOTS happy?

• GregShox | May 10, 2012, 04:50 PM EDT

  Murph46 -- Is anyone telling you who to marry?

• alisaann | May 10, 2012, 04:48 PM EDT

  MrSinatra: WRONG, gays and straights DON'T have the same rights and protections under the law...gays can be FIRED for simply being gay...they can't be on their partners insurence...they CAN'T file JOINT income tax....i don't know where you got the idea that their equal under the law....if they were equal, same-sex couple would be able to LEGALLY MARRY and have it recogonized by ALL states the way hetrosexual marriages are......get your head out of the sand. alisa

• pilib04 | May 10, 2012, 04:42 PM EDT

  The President does not stand to profit for this particular "Profile in Courage". However, it is also true that it is high time to end this form of discrimination. Loving v Virginia ended American laws against inter-racial marriage in 1967. 45 years later our President has mustered up the courage to take on the religious right and call for an end to same-sex discrimination. It is a natural progression from his ending "don't ask, don't tell" in the military. Will it hurt him. I would guess that those who were voting for him will not be too upset with this new position. Is feidir linn.

• Murph46 | May 10, 2012, 04:39 PM EDT

  Amen MrSinatra a voice of wisdom from the wilderness.Next we will be told what to watch ,read,eat(they are already doing that).

• GregShox | May 10, 2012, 04:38 PM EDT

  I'd like to hear an honest answer to this. What is it about gay relationships that people find so revolting?

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 04:37 PM EDT

  Peggy, "marriage" is not only a religious state. many marriages are formed and sanctioned only by gov't. as i understand it, gays want that secular, legal title of marriage, and are not petitioning the gov't to force churches to provide them the "holy sacrament" of marriage.
  
  this is why i support states rights. i believe one state should be able to do things the way it wants, while another state can do the opposite. if a state legalizes gay marriage via the normal, legistlative process, then i do NOT object to it.

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 04:26 PM EDT

  Mouse, do you really think anyone takes that seriously? so let me get this straight, if a politician doesn't want to force an insurance company to give away birth control, or whatever for free, its a war on women? is it a war on men if they don't force them to include vascetomys?
  
  the gov't should A. not be involved in health care at all, and B. should not be telling insurance companies, employers, or anyone else what to provide or not FOR FREE! what insanity, next you'll want them to tell supermarkets to provide spinach with every purchase.

• Peggy P | May 10, 2012, 04:25 PM EDT

  I have had gay friends and have a gay cousin. I feel they should be allowed to all this country has to offer regardless of their partiners. They should be entitled to join in a Civil Union giving them the same rights and benefits afforded married couples but I draw the line on the Holy Sacrament of Marriage which should be between and Man and a woman.

• Mousemess | May 10, 2012, 04:09 PM EDT

  BrianO, The "war on women" refers to certain adversarial things from very conservative legislators (both male and female legislators in the USA are guilty of pushing anti-woman legislation) against women like trying to destroy the right of women to their part of health care that has to do with their reproductive rights and health issues germaine to being women, allowing employers to object to employee insurance plans that have to do with certain type of health care that could impact women's health and also problems like in some areas women still not being paid the same as men for the same type of work. There was even a Congressional panel on women's health that was insanely all male with not a single woman on that panel! That is just one more thing that is not right in how the most conservative politicians deal with women's issues in this country.

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 04:06 PM EDT

  Eiriamach, i can't make it any more clear than i have. the majority is not depriving the minority anything. gays have the same rights as heterosexuals do, and for that matter polygamists.
  
  just b/c they want something recognized by gov't and society that until very recently never was anywhere in the western world, does NOT mean that they are being deprived of rights the majority enjoys. ALL PEOPLE, gay, straight, polygamist, whatever, ALL PEOPLE have the right to marry ONE other person of the OPPOSITE sex, period. that is the standard that is equally applied to all people.
  
  you don't have to like it, you don't have to say its fair, but what you can't do in an intellectually honest way, is say that that isn't true.

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 04:00 PM EDT

  Greg, what people want has absolutely NOTHING to do with what rights they have or don't have.
  
  the fact is, homosexuals and heterosexuals share the exact same set of rights. they are treated exactly the same legally speaking. they are both allowed to do exactly the same thing, ie. marry someone of the opposite sex. and gays do, and have, for years, married someone of the opposite sex, and no one can stop them from doing so just b/c they are gay.

• eiriamach | May 10, 2012, 04:00 PM EDT

  @Mr Sinatra, No, he's not correct. It's a violation of the moral law for a majority to deprive a minority of rights and advantages that the majority enjoy. It does not matter whether it's whites passing Jim Crow laws that exclude African Americans from equal education and employment, or heterosexuals deciding that homosexuals will not have the financial and personal benefits of marriage. It's power politics that uses law to exclude one group from the benefits enjoyed by the other. Withholding equal treatment on the basis of sexual orientation is wrong.

• Mousemess | May 10, 2012, 03:48 PM EDT

  Irish and Proud, We know the statistics here about how many states, that's not lost on us in the USA. What you left out is that in 2012 about 50% of Americans nationwide (even in states that have these amendments) favor same-sex marriage and about 50% do not. The percentage in favor has increased in the USA over the years. It's predicted that within 20 years, all of these constitutional amendments in all of these states will be reversed likely by popular vote. In North Carolina the percentage of voters in favor was 58% to 42%. Much less percentagewise than in Texas over the same type of amendment. in Texas, the vote was like 76% in favor. At some past time, North Carolina would have been more like Texas is now about that. But attitudes have changed in NC even amongst elderly NC residents who have lived their whole lives in NC. No, NC has the smallest percentage in favor of this amendment of most any of the southern states including neighboring Virginia to the north which went more for this amendment that did NC. NC has 8 counties where the opposition to the amendment was the majority vote. Counties like those in the center of state where Raleigh the state capital is and counties where University of North Carolina is located at the cities of Durham, Chapel Hill, etc. The Triad area of Durham, Chapel Hill and Raleigh are some of the most liberal parts of NC. Typical of the USA where often the most liberal areas (even in very conservative states) tend to be often university towns. University towns in the USA bring young people with fresh and less rigid idea, more mixing of people, sometimes more employment,learning, science, arts that enrich peoples' lives.

• GregShox | May 10, 2012, 03:44 PM EDT

  MrSinatra -- Because by definition, the only people who want same-sex marriage are gay. Why would a straight person want it? It's a ridiculous comment.

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 03:33 PM EDT

  Greg, he is totally correct. a heterosexual and a homosexual have EXACTLY the same set of rights. they both can marry someone of the opposite sex, and no one can prevent that.
  
  homosexuals are in fact seeking something "new." they want the right to marry the same sex, and have it recognized as legal by the gov't and society, and if they got that right, it would have to be extended to heterosexuals as well. so i don't know why you are mocking Sean?

• GregShox | May 10, 2012, 03:26 PM EDT

  seanskelligs, I'm still laughing at your comment: "They are looking for an extra right to marry same sex that nobody else has." Do you think at all before you start hammering the keyboard?

• MrSinatra | May 10, 2012, 03:25 PM EDT

  "With that statement the president has made it clear that it's wrong to prevent couples who are in loving, committed relationships from getting married." why is it wrong only when its two people, and not three or more? if gays are allowed to married, there is no reason to justify preventing 3 or more to marry. if you can't limit it to just a man and a woman, the standard since time began, then you can't limit it to just "two" to suit your own ends either.

• eiriamach | May 10, 2012, 03:23 PM EDT

  BrianO, this far I agree with you-- Obama's statement will increase polarization on this and other 'social' issues. It makes the gap between conservatives and others, which was already wide as an ocean, seem even more unbridgeable. Extreme difference would not be so serious a problem if we still could talk with each other. But when I see below reactions like "nonsense on stilts," "Obama is now in pay back mode," "perverts vote also," "Whatever will get the votes dummy!" and "cheap self-serving" (BKearns and rosary33's words do not bear repeating) I question whether we can have any rational exchange of views that could result in SOMETHING to agree on. It's a groundwater-level political decision: we should talk about it in terms of keeping our civil society united rather than fragmented. Where I do not agree with you is thinking that Obama acted deliberately to widen the gulf and create further division. I think he has an educator's instinct to get people thinking and changing rather than just reacting.

• Mousemess | May 10, 2012, 03:17 PM EDT

  Stevestar, Obama never said he was an Irish citizen. He really means to say that as a man with an African father and a white mother he had a white grandmother who was from an Irish town. But being part white and since people of Irish descent are well represented in all the white-majority English-speaking countries of world from Eire and UK to Canada and USA to Australia and New Zealand it's quite possible that he had a grandmother born in Muine Gall, Contae Uibh Fhaili, Poblacht na hEireann. And really, Steven, it's NOT LIKE HE WERE RUNNING FOR PRESIDENT OF IRELAND anyway.

• seanskelligs | May 10, 2012, 03:02 PM EDT

  More of the gay propaganda and a tissue of lies. Firstly there is no evidence 50% of people support it-it has been rejected by over 30 states. Gay people already have equality-everybody can marry someone of the opposite sex and not same sex. They are looking for an extra right to marry same sex that nobody else has. I suggest if they stopped trying to ram their sexuality down peoples throat they would be more successful-how many straight people tell all and sundry they are straight-pretty well none yet all gay people make a point of telling people-its irrelevant what your sexuality is in life. We dont want to know and dont want it in our face.I suggest this is the reason there is discrimination as Cahir suggests-personally I dont know of any and view his assertions of suicide, disowning families etc as a pack of lies looking for the sympathy vote-this pathetic article certainly made my mind up about the election. As a gay Irishman your opinion is irrelevant in a US election-it has nothing to do with you and applies to US voters

• BrianO | May 10, 2012, 03:01 PM EDT

  eiriamach, as the election of obama was to bridge the divide of racial relations and we were to be post racial, he has done the opposite, and promoted racial tension. Divide the electorate demonize your opponent. The same will happen with the same sex issues, your hopes for positive improvement will be used by this president to divide America further and demonize his opponents.

• GregShox | May 10, 2012, 02:52 PM EDT

  There's an awful lot of insecurity on display here. If you're happy in your own relationship, why do you care how other people lead their lives? The Irish don't have a problem with same-sex relationships. Isn't is about time Americans who claim Irish descent got over their prejudices?

• Mousemess | May 10, 2012, 02:52 PM EDT

  Misneac... Seans go bhfuil ciall agus oideachas nios fearr na seafoid a shileadh mar sin ag muintir Mhuine Gall i dtaobh Obama! Perhaps the people of Muine Gall/Moneygall have better sense and education than to think nonsense concerning Obama like that! (For Americans reading this...the "Money" part of the anglocized town name Moneygall comes from the Irish word "muine" (pronounced mwin-yeh) meaning "thicket" and not from the English word "money". There are several other Irish town names with "money" as part of the name)

• KittyMurphy | May 10, 2012, 02:50 PM EDT

  @Stevenstar Who are ye shouting at!? Do you know caplocks / uppercase text is considered aggressive online. Reeelax would ye. As for sentence structure and sense...well!

• eiriamach | May 10, 2012, 02:49 PM EDT

  Thanks, Eschetic, for writing your insights about the history and the future of this issue. I find your words very encouraging. Only one question, the same question I have about the Log Cabin Republicans: why are you still in the GOP, considering its opposition to human rights of LGBTs?

• STEVENSTAR | May 10, 2012, 02:44 PM EDT

  OBAMA IS IRISH NOW TOO ? HAHA! I WONDER IF THEY'RE ACTUALLY ANY AMERICANS LEFT OVER IN AMERICA THESE DAYS OR ARE THEY ALL IRISH... OBAMA IS AS IRISH TO US AS IM FROM OUT SPACE ... PLEASE !! WHAT SOME GREAT GREAT GRANNY OF HIS CAME FROM MONEYGALL A VILLAGE IN MIDDLE OF NOWHERE... THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM IRISH ... AS FOR GAY MARRIAGE ITS ABOUT TIME AMERICA CAUSGHT UP WITH THE REST OF THE WORLD, MIND U I CANNOT SEE THAT HAPPENING ANY DAY SOON,, THEY'RE ALL TOO UPTIGHT AND OH SO 'OPINIONATED AND PERFECT FOR ANYONE TO ALLOW GAY MARRIAGE IN AMERICA..SO ILL BELIEVE THAT WHEN I SEE IT ...

• IrishAndProud | May 10, 2012, 02:35 PM EDT

  I trust that when Obama said this decision should be left to the states, he therefore supports the decisions of the people of 32 states and counting, thus far, who've said no to this. He carefully (and obviously) waited until the day after North Carolina (a state he carried in '08 but will not carry, this year) voted down same-sex 'marriage' to make his announcement -- but people saw right through that. So I trust he actually meant what he said (about states making their own decisions...which they are, loudly and clearly) and will advise all activist judges to call off the dogs and quit trying to force states to have this, once the people have spoken (and the courts don't change minds, anyway).

• Eschetic | May 10, 2012, 02:29 PM EDT

  As a lifelong active Republican (albeit one who views this president who has pulled us back from the edge of a Bush Depression and restored the respect the REST of the world once had for this country as the best we've had since Eisenhower), I rather wished he's done it in the first months AFTER the last or next election knowing what the right wing will try to make of it, but if anyone is reasonable enough to actually listen to the WAY he said it, his words are impossible to argue with from either philosophical or legal perspective. As a gay man who will celebrate his 32nd anniversary with my partner this Thanksgiving, I've seen how far we've come in that time and am eternally grateful for the Chief Executive finally placing the Government on the side of genuine equal rights and support for the stable relationships all civilizations need to continue. High time. The REAL question of "gay marriage" was settled once the first state recognized it - and litigated LONG ago when the Supreme Court recognized how Constitutionally protected and central to their human rights the right to marry was to the human rights of our black brethren (Loving vs. Virginia), so all of this foot dragging by the radical right and know-nothings who refuse to recognize the difference between religious and CIVIL marriage (in point of fact, CHURCHES were among the FIRST to recognize our unions!) is really a rearguard action in a war already effectively won - but every step toward recognition of long term, mutually supportive unions is a victory for ALL marriage; especially when so many "straights" who were never taught that sustaining a relationship takes a lifetime of WORK seem to be doing everything in their power to undercut the institution. We can do better - we can't do worse.

• misneac | May 10, 2012, 02:03 PM EDT

  Please dont tell them in Moneygall that Obama is gay !

• Nicomax | May 10, 2012, 02:03 PM EDT

  Romney's position on this issue is clearly political since the easy path is to support the vast majority over a limited minority. If we all voted directly on the civil rights of those groups representing a small % of the population then there would be concerns for Jews, Muslims, left-handers, redheads, and yes, Mormans.

• eiriamach | May 10, 2012, 01:53 PM EDT

  BrianO, the US Constitution leaves to the states the right to regulate marriages, to decide minimum age and other requirements, subject to the US Constitution's "equal treatment under the law" provision. I don't see how Obama's statement in support of marriage equality shows that he has any interest in changing the US Constitution. He was a constitutional law professor. He knows what's possible and what's not. His Dept. of Justice reached the conclusion that DOMA is unconstitutional, and his administration does not enforce it. I'm no lawyer, but I believe that the Supreme Court would be compelled to agree. I don't follow your reasoning.

• BrianO | May 10, 2012, 01:39 PM EDT

  Eirmach, the question is relative for this reason, Obama's end game is not same sex marriage in my opinion. Instead it is to change the constitution of the U.S which he considers a negative document. We are protected from dictators with this document.

• BrianO | May 10, 2012, 12:58 PM EDT

  the first time Obama tries to shift the media presence from his record is initiated by George Stephanopolis in a Republican debate question to Romney about outlawing contraception, That was the war on women ploy. Now Obama shifts the spin to gay marriage, to deflect from his record. My guess is the next smoke screen will involve illegal immigration.

• weeknocky | May 10, 2012, 12:53 PM EDT

  Kilgara - totally agree with you. So sad when they use a non-issue to garner votes.

• handsome68 | May 10, 2012, 12:52 PM EDT

  Re: the headline "As a Gay Irishman, Obama's support on same sex marriage means everything", by Cahir O'Doherty, I may be wrong, of course, but I don't believe I've ever read or heard that Mr. Obama was, or is, a gay Irishman. I daresay I'd have learned of it, living as I do in the West Village.

• eiriamach | May 10, 2012, 12:44 PM EDT

  BrianO, neither of us can really know whether Obama acted on ulterior, purely political, motives. How is the question relevant? The point made in Cahir's article is that Obama's taking a side makes a tremendous difference. It encourages others to move forward in their thinking, and it affirms the equality of same-sex partners in our civil society. Those are good results from my perspective, whether Obama is a cynical political-hack opportunist or a humane individual struggling to find the right stuff in himself. Obama's state of soul is between him and God. Obama's statement of belief in equality enhances my quality of life because I hate discrimination and the bigotry it breeds; he brought us one step closer to the kind of world I want us and our children to live in. BTW, I'm American, born and bred, like you, I assume.

• kilgara | May 10, 2012, 12:29 PM EDT

  Anyone who believes this statement was anything other than a very carefully thought out political ploy by a back-room , corrupt political hack foisted on this nation by the crooked Chicago machine is not a fool but a damn fool.A man who advocates killing babies after they leave the womb will say or do ANYTHING to attain and keep power.Where did it all go so tragically wrong? God save America!

• Mousemess | May 10, 2012, 12:27 PM EDT

  A Chathaoir Ui Dhochartaigh, Go raibh mile maith agat as ucht do mhisnigh i d'fhoilsiu tu fein dona leitheoiri an ailt seo mar dhuine aerach. Bionn a lan fuatha i gcoinne daoine aeracha sa laethanta seo san aonu cead is fiche fiu. Taim buioch den Uachtaran Obama as ucht a raitis ar phosadh idir dhaoine aeracha beag beann ar (beag beann ar.. regardless of)a thoghchan, Dick Cheney, Joe Biden, na meain chumarsaide, srl. Thank you very much Cahir O' Doherty for your courage in revealing yourself to the readers of this article as a gay person. There is much animosity against gay people even in these days in the 21st century. I am thankful to President Obama for his statement on marriage between gay people regardless of his election, Dick Cheney, Joe Biden,the communications (news) media, etc.

• Monsoonman | May 10, 2012, 12:26 PM EDT

  Useful idiots. While Rome burns U draw your line in the sand by your "right" to how you have sex...pitiful

• hollabackgurl | May 10, 2012, 12:12 PM EDT

  "It's not discriminatory to discriminate against people," writes Los Leandros with perfect idiocy. The right has had decades to outline how gay couples getting married 'hurts' or is an 'attack' on opposite sex marriage. They have failed to do so. They should outlaw divorce if they want to save marriage. Blaming gays for the state of heterosexual marriage is idiotic.

• Mick10000 | May 10, 2012, 12:03 PM EDT

  Here is a fact (as in not just a belief) for those of you who consider same sex attraction "unnatural": same sex sexual activity has been observed in over 300 species on this earth. Homophobia has been observed in only one. With that in mind, which is more "unnatural"?

• BrianO | May 10, 2012, 12:00 PM EDT

  eirmach, there must be cultural differences on this subject in America and Ireland and I don't and cannot speak from the Irish perspective. In the States there is great variances from how people are treated, but from my experiences most are not treated poorly. Children can be brutal to each other, they can push others that are different to the edge and sometimes over. This is where good people raise good children to not be swayed by a gang mentality. On the subject of Obama and this issue, I tried to show in my first post how he shaped his view for political purpose, I believe the timing of this shift is twofold. First to deflect attention from his record, the economy jobs etc., and to bolster his california fund raising effort which he kicks off this week at actor George Clooney estate.

• eiriamach | May 10, 2012, 11:53 AM EDT

  hermitTalker thinks "There is absolutely no right in civil and reliigous law to actively violate the rights of any human by emotional, sexual or physical abuse." Agreed, BUT marriage is a voluntary union, and same-sex marriage violates no one's rights. It is no more likely to inflict "emotional, sexual or physical abuse" than heterosexual marriage (in fact, studies indicate there's much less child abuse in the homes of same-sex partners). hermitTalker has taken the pre-Conciliar RC position that "error has no rights." In the USA, Error has the same Constitutional rights to freedom of speech and conscience, privacy, and equal treatment under the law as Truth has! I hasten to add that I do not consider same-sex relationships "error," and that Nature shows us the naturalness of same-sex mating among other species as well as humans. hermitTalker, your natural law argument needs updating. Since the middle ages, scientists have discovered many surprises about what's "natural." Even under house arrest by the Inquisition, Galileo managed to get the truth to the people.

• jamieLM | May 10, 2012, 11:27 AM EDT

  My focus is on my own straight marriage. I'm not really interested in any other adult's romantic and sexual relationships. So far, no gay marriages in states that allow it have had any affect on my happy marriage. I don't feel threatened by who other adults choose to love. My concerns are my husband and kids, Islamic terrorists, the national debt, incurable diseases, my tiny NICU patients, etc. Gay marriage is not even on my list. I'm not interested in trying to prevent other adults from finding happiness through marriage, whether gay or straight. Live and let live in the pursuit of happiness and equal rights in America. Life is short.

• eiriamach | May 10, 2012, 10:28 AM EDT

  Don't feel sorry for me, BrianO. I was never truly harmed by rejection or baiting. It sharpened and focused my thinking and kept me educating myself to deal with it. It has challenged my values and strengthened them. Feel sorry for those, especially the young, who really are punished, beaten, driven out, sometimes driven to suicide or killed in hate crimes. When people do those things in the name of Christianity or some illusion of homogeneous 'Irishness" or other 'in-group' or family trait-- which they invariably claim they are "protecting"-- they create a horror for all of us. Usually when we say a young person has "run away," we know that a parent's insistence that he or she change has, in effect, driven the youth out-- "great lengths to protect," indeed.

• Los Leandros | May 10, 2012, 10:25 AM EDT

  One does'nt want to hurt anyone's feelings, but so-called gay marriage is a nonsense on stilts. Even the voters of Caliofornia, possibly the most liberally brainwashed electorate in the western world, voted against gay marriage in a referendum. It's not discrimination to treat different things in different ways. Marriage has & alway's will be exclusively between a man and woman. Are there no rational individuals in the Democratic party who will speak up against this nonsense ?.

• mairint | May 10, 2012, 10:22 AM EDT

  Sodomy can never be compared to the marriage act. No use trying to pretend. Too many men have lost their identity of manhood. Because Obama is now in pay back mode for the backing he got from the homosexual organizations he has to go back on his earlier support for true natural marriage. In any case who can admire a man who has enabled massive funding for the killing of countless preborn children. Some President - God help America.

• NYCsheridan | May 10, 2012, 10:21 AM EDT

  Lost in all the vitriol is the simple fact that Obama has not come out in support of a Federal law. He has said exactly the same thing that Dick Cheney said in 2004. Cheney stated that he was "not opposed to gay marriage, and that it is up to the states to decide". That is EXACTLY what Obama just said.

• pegness | May 10, 2012, 10:14 AM EDT

  He's a flip flopper. Whatever will get the votes dummy!

• borefield | May 10, 2012, 09:58 AM EDT

  Of course it's a cheap self serving act for Obama to endorse Gay Marraige , he needs the votes Stupid!. He doesn,'t have the integrity to stand up for what's he truly believes, then, what does one expect from an unprincipled man.

• BrianO | May 10, 2012, 09:46 AM EDT

  Eiriamach, interesting, parents bait their children and physically injure them, I'd be interested to know where you got this fact from. Most parents want only the best for their children and go to great lengths to protect them, I feel sorry for you if this was not the case.

• eiriamach | May 10, 2012, 09:19 AM EDT

  Well said! I too have seen this: "parents, brothers and sisters bait them, belittle them, physically injure them, or turn their backs on them." I've also seen people driven out of "in-groups," from churches and clubs and Irish-language organizations and other groups, for resisting or even not taking part in gay baiting, feminist bashing, liberal baiting, or racist jokes. I hope adults understand Obama's completed "evolution" as the moral lesson that it is. We can be better than we are!

• BrianO | May 10, 2012, 09:18 AM EDT

  FEBRUARY 1996: "I favor legalizing same-sex marriages, OCTOBER 2004: " What I believe is that marriage is between a man and a woman … What I believe, in my faith, is that a man and a woman, when they get married, are performing something before God, and it's not simply the two persons who are meeting," then-U.S. Senate candidate Obama said in an interview with WTTW Chicago public television.OCTOBER 2010: " I have been to this point unwilling to sign on to same-sex marriage DECEMBER 2010: " My feelings about this are constantly evolving. I struggle with this JUNE 2011: " The president has never favored same-sex marriage. He is against it. JUNE 2011: " I think it's important for us to work through these issues because each community is going to be different, each state is going to be different," Obama said when asked during a White House press conference about New York becoming the latest state to legalize same-sex marriage. OCTOBER 2011: "I'm still working on it," Obama said when asked by ABC's George Stephanopoulos whether he would move from supporting civil unions for same-sex couples to supporting gay marriage.***** Just a time line of the presidents views found online that shows he uses this topic for political purposes only, trust himif you like but don't go to the ballot box blind.