Virulent anti-Catholicism is alive and well in modern Britain. It is particularly interesting to watch this spectacle of hatred from the neighbouring island to the west - one which has felt first-hand the depth of British hatred of Catholicism for many centuries.
There was rabid anti-Catholicism in Cromwell’s massacres of thousands of innocent Irish people in the 1600s. There was anti-Catholicism in the British authorities who subjected millions of Irish to dispossession, death, disease and oppression in their own country throughout the 18th and 19th centuries.
There was anti-Catholicism in the British troops who fired over the head of my grandmother when, as 6-year-old, she hid from them in the hedgerows on her way to school. It seethed in the British soldiers who burned my home city of Cork to the ground in 1920. More recently, it lurked in the Paratroopers who shot dead 13 innocent Catholic civil rights marchers in Derry in 1972.
For a while it seemed that this old hostility had expired, but the shrieking intensity of anti-Catholic hatred in recent months has shown that it was merely resting.
Its resurgence has troubled even prominent UK-based atheists like Padraig Reidy, who recently wrote in the Observer that “Catholicism is viewed with suspicion by significant sections of the British left” and traces the present vitriol back to these ancient hatreds.
Brendan O’Neill of Spiked, says “the campaigning against [the pope’s] visit has become so shrill that soon only dogs will be able to hear it. And the great irony of this allegedly rationalist protest against the pope is that it is indulging in precisely the kind of demonology that the Catholic Church once excelled at. Campaigners have turned Benedict into a Satan for secularists, an Antichrist for atheists, against whom they desperately hope to define and advertise their own moral integrity.
Indeed, I cannot think of an instance in modern European history where any nation was so convulsed by vitriolic hatred of a particular religion since the Nuremburg Rallies, which themselves have recently featured nightly on the BBC: no news item on the pope is complete without a sinister soundtrack and archive footage of goose-stepping Nazis. Yet this hatred comes not from the old establishment right. It is primarily from the left.
Much of it stems from plain cowardice: The fact is that radical Islam, not Catholicism, is the big religious problem that British society faces, but most commentators are afraid of their lives, quite literally, to speak out against its tenets; and so they treat the Catholic Church as a punch bag for their repressed hostility to Islam. This was made clear in Polly Toynbee’s recent column for the Guardian where she bizarrely conflated Catholicism and Islam. Hence too Richard Dawkins’ comment that Catholicism is the world’s “second most evil religion.”
The pope is expected to praise Britain’s record of tolerance, yet as The Irish Times noted this morning: “in practice, that has been extended to Catholics only in the last century and a half.”
However, The Irish Times is being far too generous with history: In Northern Ireland, a part of the UK, such prejudice and institutionalised state-sponsored discrimination continued unabated until at least the 1970s. In less formal ways, it continues to this very day throughout many parts of the UK.
A cursory glance at the British press, which would normally pride itself on its tolerance in matters ethnic, religious and racial, shows extreme intolerance of a Church which dares to contradict its secular creed. However, for all the political correctness about race, it is not at all difficult to tolerate a person with a different skin tone. The real test of tolerance comes when you meet people with different ideas. In this, the British media has utterly failed the test of its tolerance of other’s views; and this failure is most pronounced on the left.
The Catholic Church’s hierarchy has given plenty of good reasons to criticise it, but in Britain, many of its critics’ motivations now go far beyond a fair-minded exploration of its faults, and far beyond the anger most Catholics share at the abuse cover up. They also fail distinguish between the hierarchy and the 1 billion plus people who really comprise the Church.
The real issue at stake goes to the great existential and philosophical split of our times: between those who believe in the spiritual and those who don’t; and those who believe in an objective morality and those who think right and wrong are relative, negotiable and arbitrary. Let’s call this latter view the “secular orthodoxy,” (the eminently sensible Henry Porter of the Observer, an atheist, refers to it critically using this term.)
This morally relativistic secular orthodoxy is by far the dominant ideology in Britain and in much of its media. The pope’s stated aim is to take on this moral relativism and its exponents appear to have decided that ad hominem attacks on “God’s Rottweiler” are the best way forward.
There are real moral debates to be had, especially around issues of homosexuality and married priests, but at some level of their being, the people who lead the cheers for the secular orthodoxy fear that their dream of a secular utopia is doomed – perhaps because in Britain it is clear that it has already failed.
Much criticism of the Church is fair-minded and based in fact. However, some have other, more sinister agendas. Such adherents of the secular orthodoxy often frame much of their criticism of the Church along these lines: “I just love children, justice and human rights so much that I feel I simply must speak out against this nasty Church”.
However, a deeper look at those who shout loudest often shows a dark hypocrisy: Peter Tatchell’s recent hour-long attack on the Pope and the Church on British television was, he claimed, founded upon his concern for children. Yet he campaigns for it to be made legal for 14-year-olds to have sex with adults. Worse, in 1997, Mr. Tatchell wrote a letter to the Guardian defending an academic book about “Boy-Love” saying that the book’s arguments were “courageous.” He said “several of my friends - gay and straight, male and female - had sex with adults from the ages of nine to 13.”
Did he report this to the police? No, instead he contends that “it was their conscious choice and gave them great joy.”
Nine years old.
Or witness the comments by prominent agony-aunt and former nurse Claire Rayner that, “I have no language with which to adequately describe Joseph Alois Ratzinger. In all my years as a campaigner I have never felt such animus against any individual as I do against this creature….The only thing to do is to get rid of him.”
This prompted speculation as to whether by “get rid of him” she meant “kill him”. Ms. Rayner has in the past recommended that Down’s syndrome children be killed before birth. Perhaps it is the pope’s opposition to such eugenicist policies that irks her: In fact, in 1941 one of the pope’s cousins, who had Down's syndrome, was murdered in the Nazis' "euthanasia" campaign.
Yet “anti-pedophiles” who want to legalize child sex and members of the “caring profession” who want to eradicate people with Down’s syndrome are typical enough of the thinkers that inform a great deal of the criticism of Catholicism in modern Britain.
We all know that Church has been deeply flawed and it has done wrong. We all know about the recent scandals; however the anti-Catholic hysteria that has enveloped Britain is not motivated by that. The recent abuse scandals serve merely as an excuse to open the floodgates for an ancient national hatred, and to air the shrieking grievances of multiple activists and fringe groups with radical and often-dark agendas.
Brendan O’Neill, a compelling humanist-atheist writer, says: “These pope-protesters threaten to drain the last drop of decency from old-fashioned humanism, turning a once-principled outlook into little more than a requirement to hate religion… Today it is a powerful sense of lack within modern-day so-called humanist circles – a feeling of directionless and soullessness – that leads them to invent religious demons against which they might posture and pontificate. That is why they talk in such religious tones (ironically) about the Catholic Church’s ‘clinging and systematic evil that is beyond the power of exorcism to dispel’ – because this is about cynically cobbling together some sense of their own goodness and mission. And in the irony to end all ironies, they make use of the very religious tools that secularists once hoped to supersede with reason – intolerance, fear-stoking, demonology – as part of their self-serving campaign.”
As well as this sense of “lack” there is also perhaps a sneaking sense of shame behind much of the anti-Catholic sniping:
For one of the sad truths about modern British society is that it is falling to pieces: It has amongst the highest European rates of divorce, single parenthood, teenage pregnancies, abortion, alcohol and drug abuse, sexually transmitted diseases and violent crime.
All this stems from Britain’s abandonment of its shared heritage, values and community - the ineffable loss summed up in Prime Minister Cameron’s phrase, “the broken society”.
Only 50 years ago Britain was widely admired as one of the most gentle, civilised, safe and harmonious societies in the world. This civilisation was underpinned and sustained by the very Christian-derived values that the anti-Catholic commentators now so viciously attack and mock. The secularist experiment in Britain has failed: It has become a chaotic, fragmented, decadent nation that increasingly resembles Rome after the fall.
In their bones, many British people I have spoken to feel that a shadow has passed over their country in recent years. They mourn deeply for what it once was. There is something indefinable in the British air these days: a sense of tension, fear, unease and foreboding. It is no longer a pleasant land. There is little warmth: society has broken in to bickering ethnic, religious and ideological factions. Some quarter million of its citizens flee every year (mainly those who can afford to). They, by choice, are emigrating to America, Australia, Canada, Italy, France, Ireland and Spain – places where some basic sense of shared values, (which Catholicism in many ways represents) remains a part of the social fabric.
Perhaps the pope, for all his faults, uncomfortably reminds many British people of the values that once held their nation together. In doing so, they are reminded of what they have lost, and that their society is now falling apart before their very eyes.
Maybe that’s why they hate him so much.
Or maybe it’s just because he’s a German. Either way, the idea that modern Britain is a tolerant nation is dead and buried: Britain’s “aggressive secularism” has killed it.
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Switch to the desktop site to post a comment.Cromwell | Nov 16, 2010, 01:02 AM EST
All this article tells me is that many still have a giant chip on their shoulder. Furthermore, you so get the feeling that Rory doesn't have a clue what he's on about.
downinthebasement | Oct 18, 2010, 03:04 PM EDT
What was the Church's role in the 1930's? What was Pius XII's role in the 1930's and 1940's? What was Ireland's role in the 1930's and 1940's?
dogbytes | Oct 09, 2010, 09:11 PM EDT
Oh come on, what a ridiculous article. Can't you see that all the protests against the Pope are about his stance on contraception and gay rights. And even worse, his cover up of the disgusting sexual abuse. I'm an Irish man living in London. Modern Britain is a very welcoming and open minded place for me. You are paranoid and living in the past. You should live in the present and stop judging things from afar.
haikued2 | Sep 27, 2010, 01:10 PM EDT
It is right on. Historically, it is interesting because the "protestant" history goes back only about 500 years, and it also has had its moments of supreme intolerance and butchery...both from Cromwell and by Calvin in his little theocracy in Switzerland (after rebelling against theocratic rule in his "Institutes of the Christian Religion". But the English were oppressors in Ireland before Henry VIII decided he would be a better Pope than the one in Rome...odd exchange, don't you think? And why did the English kill all the Tazmanians??? Not religion, racism. So nothing really stops being stupid, it just evolves and the so called intellectual left adopts the stupidity they claim to hate...oh, intolerance is only one way...the left can be intolerant because they are the modern true believers, but the rest of us are chopped liver.
Watchman | Sep 26, 2010, 11:35 AM EDT
As someone below rightly says: tosh! This kind of stuff gives political punditry a bad name.
bertiedog1234 | Sep 20, 2010, 11:26 AM EDT
Oh dear dear!!
Nicoletta | Sep 20, 2010, 05:26 AM EDT
Great article. I particularly admire your pointing out the hypocrisy of the gay rights lobby - with their self-professed leaders Tatchell and (the luvvies luvvie) Fry. It is universally known, though rarely acknowledged in these PC enlightened times, that gay men 'like' boys. There are in fact, studies which show that 80% of the abuse cases in the US were perpetrated by gay priests.
FromPhoenix | Sep 19, 2010, 10:45 AM EDT
I am waiting for the day when EVERY paedophile priest is officially excommunicated for killing the spirits of all those young boys and girls. It's too bad that one of the many Catholic church rules, such as excommunication for abortion and refusing to give Communion to abortion supporters, doesn't include excommunication for these priests. To think of how many people unknowingly took the Body of Christ from the hands of these thousands of monster priests sends chills down my spine. And the Church knew about it. If there is anti-Catholic sentiment in UK today and elsewhere, it is fueled by the Church's sins of neglect, omission, and refusal to own up to these horrors.
LITTLEGOAT | Sep 19, 2010, 08:09 AM EDT
the allowance of horrific abuse in catholic institutions of children created the recent day hatred. slave labor in magdalene laundries of good shepherd concents and institutions was evil not religious,
hollabackgurl | Sep 19, 2010, 08:06 AM EDT
Like I said, if the Pope dared to come to Ireland now the reception would be even worse.
Newrone | Sep 18, 2010, 10:11 PM EDT
RORY FITZGERALD, you need to get down off your high horse & deal with some of your own hatred. You sound positively dangerous.
jacersagain | Sep 18, 2010, 08:54 PM EDT
All the proof that anyone wants of the charge that Britain is anti-Catholic will be destroyed by the accurate recordings of the only TV station publically closely following Pope Benedict's state visit to Scotland and England can found by visiting it's website here: " haytch tee tee pee colon forward slash forward slash news dot sky dot com forward slash skynews forward slash pope " Lots to see, hear and read of, all of it true and ongoing ahead of the beatification of John Newman tomorrow morning.
AlunPalmer | Sep 18, 2010, 01:36 PM EDT
First let me put my cards on the table. I'm an English atheist of Irish catholic descent. To be sure, the English oppressed Irish catholics in the past when they had done them no harm, and that was a disgrace. So much has been written about it that I have little to add. I agree entirely that Cromwell was a monster. He displaced the leaders of my own clan to County Clare, throwing them off their land in County Cork. Don't forget, though, that the catholic church had done plenty to stir up the English against them. The church endorsed the attempted Spanish invasion of England by the Armada, for one thing. Guy Fawkwes, an Englishman, attempted to blow up the Houses of Parliament in the name of Catholicism, and I have no problem atall with the practice of burning him in effigy that continues to this day. What they did wrong was to take it all out on the poor bloody Irish, but don't pretend they have no genuine reason to be against the Catholic church, because it isn't true. As for problems with catholic doctrine or the modern catholic church, I hardly know where to start. Ignoring my lack of belief itself, there are issues ranging from birth control to paedophilia, and the pope himself, when cardinal, is on record as allowing a known paedophile to remain in the church for years.
Buffalobrave | Sep 18, 2010, 12:44 PM EDT
Great article Rory guaranteed to bring all of the bigots and scum out from under their respective rocks. Gay rights my ass! 'pun intended'. Their sexual orientation as they call, it will now allow the perverts to practice their pedophilia under this guise. ( Catholic pedophiles and non- Catholic pedophiles. ) Yes, there are more pedophiles in the world that are non-Catholic. Many more than there are Catholics pedophiles! But why bash them hell that snot as good as the dirty old Catholic priests, right? Please note sarcasm!
Sparklet | Sep 18, 2010, 08:51 AM EDT
What a load of tosh. It's nothing to do with "old anti-Catholic hatreds". The majority of people in the UK aren't especially religious and most of those who are don't hate Catholics - there is a strong Catholic presence in the UK anyway. Any hatred is down to recent disclosures about paedophilia, which is what's hated in modern Britain. Obviously it exists - in all countries, not just the UK - but I have never experienced any religious bigotry.
Tilliewillow | Sep 18, 2010, 12:20 AM EDT
Baloney, baloney, baloney. It is 2010 and the Roman Catholic Church has much to answer for -- for behavior hidden which continues today. I rather doubt that there is such a thing as "anti-Catholicism". Wake up and see what's happening in today's church -- Dawson isn't far from wrong.
CitizenWhy | Sep 18, 2010, 12:11 AM EDT
Downunderyan makes a point about one of the Vatican's historic wrongs against the Irish. He neglects to mention another, more recent one (1800s) involving the UK's grand strategy (called Legitimacy) of restoring absolute monarchs on the continent. The restoration of absolute monarchy extended to the Pope as king of the Papal states. indeed British soldiers were needed to protect the Pope against the anti-monarchist mobs of Rome. As payback the Vatican agreed to order the Irish bishops to preach obedience to the British crown. I am proud to say that relative of mine was one of the bishops that told the Vatican to take a hike on this issue and publicly declared the moral legitimacy of Sinn Fein and the independence movement. ... That said, the pope's state visit to the UK is part of the UK government's desire to regularize the peace process in the north of ireland and to finally stop dancing to the tune of the Ulster Loyalists. It speaks to a change of sentiment in Westminster and is a subtle warning to the Loyalists that the UK may well be willing to give up its claim, at some point, to the six counties in Ulster.
CitizenWhy | Sep 17, 2010, 11:57 PM EDT
In my Catholic parochial school we taught to look beyond "anti-Catholicism" to see if there might be legitimate objections that people might have against Catholicism. In the current case of the Pope's visit to the UK, it is officially a state visit, as one head of state visiting another, and paid for by the British taxpayer. This leaves the visit open to a legitimate public criticism that would be inappropriate if the pope were going to the UK at the invitation of the Catholic hierarchy (who might well have preferred he didn't come) or even the Anglican hierarchy. legitimate questions to raise about the pope's visit as a state visit: the cost, the legitimacy of the Vatican as a sovereign state, the Vatican's opposition to certain human rights (homosexual marriage, for example), the Vatican's stand against contraceptives (even to prevent AIDs), etc.
warrenpoint00 | Sep 17, 2010, 11:43 PM EDT
Exelllent piece Rory....the ancestors of the displaced Irish are well educated (albeit the 18th century hedge schools pogrom under her majestys government) and are to the fore to tell the true stories of those Irish catholics who suffered under the evil empire .Well done Rory
JOHNTOBIN | Sep 17, 2010, 10:09 PM EDT
I have friends in Britain who would agree with many of the sentiments expressed in this article.
JOHNTOBIN | Sep 17, 2010, 09:31 PM EDT
To Downunderyan-Tony Blair did apologize on behalf of the British goverment for the centuries of misrule and persecution meted out to Ireland and the Irish people.We must remember also,that nearly a million people migrated from Ireland to the United Kingdom during the term of the twentieth century for better work opportunities and a higher standard of living.You only have to read various British Catholic websites to read the large number of Irish originated surnames on them.
Temerity | Sep 17, 2010, 08:13 PM EDT
I do so agree jacersagain The Pope's visit has been spectacular ,,,hope he remembers to bless Paisley before he leaves.LOL.
jacersagain | Sep 17, 2010, 08:00 PM EDT
JamesMurphy, may I tell you something? The "current anti-Catholic sentiment expressed in Britain" was largely expressed by newspapers a few days ago. It has utterly changed since. The newspapers and tv stations are falling over themselves with admiration for what is happening right now in Britain, historical moments for sure. It is gob-smacking everyone, even atheists and secularists. It has gone utterly in Christ's way of love in these past two days. I lived in Scotland for a few years... I was shocked to find the holiness of the Scottish Catholics would put Irish Catholics, including myself, to shame. Blessed be St. Ninian for ever.
jacersagain | Sep 17, 2010, 07:48 PM EDT
I think I need to bring some people up-to-date: there is little anti-Catholic sentiment in Britain. There is a huge Christian sentimentality of reason happening in Britain these historical days and no one in ICentral is there to record it personally. The events happening in Britain at the moment prove that. The thousands and thousands of people on the streets, roads and parks of Scotland and England have shown that to be true. The few protesters around against the visit are getting to know they are an infinitesimal minority comparatively. May they find the sense we Christians have found expressed by and in the love of Christ for everyone.
JamesMurphy | Sep 17, 2010, 04:13 PM EDT
The anti-Catholic sentiment currently being expressed in Britain, a largely pagan or non-church going society, is nothing new. Such ignorance has always been there. At the same time, there is a great degree of tolerance among Britons as a whole for Catholics, who number about five million among the nation's population of around sixty million. As in other countries, only about half are practicing Catholics. The current anti-Catholic sentiment is, of course, related to the Vatican's failure to deal appropriately with abusive priests and others. No country can boast of an unblemished record of tolerance, but at a certain time wounds have to be allowed to heal and the ludicrous comments by Richard Dawkins and others of his ilk don't help this process. Neither do uneducated and uninformed comments regarding Islam's place in British society.
killowen | Sep 17, 2010, 01:03 PM EDT
their fear is real - unlikely - were to be an Irish awakening UK's and its diaspora would have a lot of cutting of their flags and symbols as like the Soviet Union when the hammer and sickle had to go. The US partner would be mighty impacted as would canada aus etc.
actor47 | Sep 17, 2010, 11:29 AM EDT
This is the most irresponsible nonsense. It may sell papers etc. but the Pope's visit is truly an historical event and bespeaks a real turnaround at the highest levels of UK officialdom. This story justs feeds the old anti-British sentiments which unfortunately are still rife here in the Irish and Irish-American communities. It is truly time to move on. We have a peace process and UK Ireland relations need to be portrayed in their true light and not through the prism of past hatreds. Shame on you Niall O'Dowd, this is sloppy, sloppy talboidesque journalism.
pounder | Sep 17, 2010, 10:36 AM EDT
Hogwash...there are millions of Catholics in England....unpersecuted and allowed to practice their faith.
BallinaLass | Sep 17, 2010, 10:20 AM EDT
P.S. I forgot to say: outstanding article by Rory Fitzgerald. I hope many people get to read it.
BallinaLass | Sep 17, 2010, 10:07 AM EDT
I think it's more accurate to say that modern Britain is largely anti-Christian. Aggresive atheists hate Christianity, Catholics included, moreso than religion in general as they claim. They don't dare mock and abuse Islam, for example. Christians don't blow up things and kill people in retaliation.
barneyjo | Sep 17, 2010, 10:07 AM EDT
Katiemac, my friends who were abused were not post-pubescent; they were little boys; little trusting boys who were given by trustin parents into the hands of men and women with a very sick sense of their own sexuality. If you've not ever had to deal face to face with broken bones, broken bodies, or broken lives, then I suggest you go educate yourself, just like I had to do. It is a painful process, but if you follow it through it will give you clarity on this painful sordid matter.
OHofmanndawg | Sep 17, 2010, 09:23 AM EDT
What do I think? I think there are many more thousands of Irish Roman Catholics that hate the Irish Protestant minority than the other way around. As for Muslims, Islam should be outlawed. Europe, Australia, New Zealand, Russia, Great Brittan, Ireland, America, Canada and the West in general is based upon Christian traditions... and that includes the secular West. Pakis, Arabs, Iraqis, Iranians, Afghans, etc., either live according to our Christian ways & traditions... or get the hell out and go back to their Muslim World. Islam has proved across the globe that Muslims don't for long live in harmony with Christians, Jews, Hindus, Buddhists, etc., in the lands they migrate to. The old adage remains true.... "When in Rome, do as the Romans do.... or go back to where you came from!"
McNamara31 | Sep 17, 2010, 08:50 AM EDT
The intentful neglect by Benedict as Pope, and in his prior postion, to ethically and morally protect children worldwide for the past 20 years has fed the flames of anti Catholicism, while dishonoring past generation of Irish who held steadfast to their faith while they were victimized, starved and evicted from their homes by the Protestants in Ireland. This Pope has had the greatest negative effect on our faith and has made it very difficult for the good parish priests to do their job.
newcanaan | Sep 17, 2010, 07:56 AM EDT
when the brits run the Catholics out of england guess who is going to take there place, Muslims.let see how that gos.
Downunderyan | Sep 17, 2010, 07:05 AM EDT
It should never be forgotten that the Norman/English invasion of Ireland was sanctioned by the one and only English pope, Hadrian IV aka Nicholas Breakespeare, who issued the papal bull Laudabiliter to Henry II in 1166. The Vatican has never acknowledged this appalling miscarriage of justice, withdrawn it or apologised for inflicting 800 years of misery on Ireland. After breaking away from Rome, any claims of righteousness for the continued occupation of Ireland by Henry VIII and sequelae should have been invalidated. Ireland, Rome's longest and most loyal supporter, continues to suffer from this histrical abuse and neglect. Can we have a truth commission on this with a joint apology from the Monarchs of Rome and England followed by compensation?
Kilsally | Sep 17, 2010, 06:25 AM EDT
You do of course fail to mention the reasons for the historical anti-catholicism...............
vectors | Sep 17, 2010, 06:14 AM EDT
No mention of the thousands of people butchered by the IRA in ulster.De Valera was useless.Like the rest of The Irish establishment.Record nos of people on the dole!
vectors | Sep 17, 2010, 06:13 AM EDT
Catholicism is primitive.A s**t cod religion riddled with paedophiles and an old man who thinks he is infallible.People in the southern states of the US have no truck with this nonsense.Lol Lol.
Dublinjas | Sep 17, 2010, 01:41 AM EDT
Thanks TomSwinford of course you know the craic, My father worked away in Britain most his working life and we were all reared on that remittance as You rightly put it, and every street around me was the same, tens of thousands of Irish were fully employed in Britain in the 1950s, These were hungry days in Ireland, But with the re-building that was taking place in cities like London as a result of the War the Irish were very much welcomed.and it was indeed a great escape valve for Devalera and the Irish Government, But isn't it incredible that yet another FF Govt: is relying on Britain to yet again employ those who can not be catered for in their own country. Also Tom I remember an old Nun who used to rattle on "They'll never go through the gates" and talked about the devils children who were the protestants in the North and the English who would never get into heaven because they had no confession boxes....lol} The funny thing was no one ever told us there was Catholics up North as well.
Temerity | Sep 16, 2010, 08:29 PM EDT
What a very good article and it explains a lot of things I wasn't understanding about modern day Brittan. While in my imagination I held onto remnants of the past quite illogically . At the risk of sounding laughable I used to gauge my "image" of Brittan from the sit com "The Bill."but as the more stalwart characters have disappeared the typical "good Brit" has been replaced by other more modern and up to date characters and the only one left of the Britain I thought I could love is "Smitty", The rest are so wishy washy and lacking in true Brit Grit and character as to be just boring.And the political correctness inclusion of the blacks and glimpses of the black criminal sub culture and their arrogance the Bill has to deal with now has completely changed the image of England I nurtured.But I suppose that too is just Emgland's sins come home to roost.Still love ya Smitty don't let 'em ever change you.
Temerity | Sep 16, 2010, 08:08 PM EDT
Dublinjas and Paul6969, thank you for stating the obvious and bringing some balance and objectivity to this dubious story. Going to the primary school in Ireland many years ago, we learned every day that England was the epitome of evil and responsible for every misfortune to befall our much beloved homeland - while I and my family, and half the families of Ireland waited each week for the remittance from John Bull that kept us from going hungry. I have a lot of family in Britain and have spent much time there and have never experienced, not once ever, the kind of anti-Catholic hatred that Fitzgerald writes about - not at any level of society. There may well be a lingering anti-Catholicism in an insignificant and ever diminishing segment - perhaps some of those who still weep over loss of empire. The simple truth is - and what troubles the pope - that most Brits just don't take religion very seriously anymore and haven't for a long time.
warrenpoint00 | Sep 16, 2010, 07:42 PM EDT
You should never ever as an Irish person have to feel obliged to the british for living and working anywhere in britian. The british while occupying the island of Ireland illegally for centuries have profitted quite well while exploiting our resources through their reign of terror and murder.In the 19th century alone one million Irish people died and millions more were displaced while the brits and their little protestant planters imposed their little racket on the Irish catholic land owners.So really..really Irishman you owe britian sweet f... all. Who cares..especially the Irish what this little deflated so called empire thinks of catholics. Really.
Dublinjas | Sep 16, 2010, 05:09 PM EDT
There is very little new in anything you say Rory, But you may have left some things out Like Britain Sustaining a Million Irish Navvies and subsequently their families back in Ireland and the Irish Economy from just after the war right into the 1970s. It gave me a home and employment when I desperately needed it in the early 70s, When there were precious few other places you could get too never mind find a job.. So maybe there was and is an enmity there I was never really aware of it from the ordinary Brits, I know I earned good money there enough to educate myself and acquire life skills,something I never got in my own Catholic dominated Nation of Ireland And maybe it might be time to put Cromwell to bed even though he is the greatest weapon the Catholic church has to bring up when it needs to take the spotlight of its own wrongs, And of course we always have the Black and Tans but one thing you did not mention was how many priests were spies for the Tans and how many IRA Men did the church Excommunicate because of membership of the IRA during the Tan wars??. .. but hey whats a few facts here or there...
barneyjo | Sep 16, 2010, 04:32 PM EDT
Why single out Britian in this case? This argument could be applied equally to Ireland for example and its resurgent anti-semitism and racism. The words "pot" "kettle" and "black" spring to mind (I am a practicing Irish Catholic, resident in Northern Ireland BTW)
Rebelforce | Sep 16, 2010, 04:20 PM EDT
A secular Britain may be a good thing actually. Let's just hope the British don't go back to their murderous, fanatical, anti-Catholic Religious phase represented by Oliver "the Butcher" Cromwell and his seventeenth century Puritans. Those sour English Puritans and their various Old Testament thumping sects may be long gone and forgotten.....but the Roman Catholic Church has survived. Indeed not only survived, it's now said to be the largest Christian faith in Britain.
sirpeter | Sep 16, 2010, 02:01 PM EDT
@ paul6969, In answer to your question,during the war of independence all protestants who did not spy for the british army and who behaved in the proper manner, their life's and property were under the protection of the IRA,During this time alot more Catholic spies were shot then Protestants spies. The Black and Tans/British army started burning Catholic houses and terrorizing the population in order to bring out the IRA into the open,so the IRA started burning some large protestant homes in return. The Protestant's kicked up a fuss to the British army and told them to stop burning Catholic houses,to which they did,The IRA then stopped burning Protestant homes as well. Protestant's have always been treated with respect in the Republic and still are.Not one inch of land or any business or property was taken away after independence from the protestants.Even though this land was taken by force during the Cromwellian era,only 10% of the land was in Catholic hands after the penal laws.After the act of union of 1800,no Catholic was allowed to sit in parliament and only got emancipation after 1823 and even then a Catholic had to have a certain amount of wealth. Catholic's had to pay one tenth of their income to the protestant church and if they didn't pay,soldiers would come and take what you had by force,resist and they take your life.Read about the penal laws in Ireland and what will surprise you is the restraint and respect Catholics have shown to Protestants when they got independence.Ireland's first president was a protestant after independence.what i suggest is that you read up a little more Irish history to get a deeper understanding of what went on in Ireland.There is one difference between the Catholics who went to England and the Protestants who came to Ireland.Catholics went to England to work,Protestant's came to Ireland to plunder.
paul6969 | Sep 16, 2010, 12:32 PM EDT
What a ridiculous article. Since irish independence large numbers of irish catholics have come to live and work in britain,very few went back. Despite this ,some were deeply anti British and supported the murderous IRA terrorists. Catholics occupy prominent positions in all aspects of Britains political,cultural and business life. can that be said for the small protestant population that stayed on in southern ireland after independence?