124 Comments

• NYCsheridan | Jun 03, 2012, 08:33 AM EDT

  Allan and sean, get a room. Nobody cares. Grow up, the two of you.

• allan07 | May 04, 2012, 04:15 PM EDT

  @seanomelb you proved several things. 1. You stated on 29th April 09:11 EDT that St. Columba won the battle of Cul Dreimhne. QUOTE "Colmcille won the battle of Cul Dreimhne and sent king Dairmid packing" UNQUOTE. Of course your simply incorrect. It couldn't be more untrue. St. Columba lost 3000 men the king almost zero. Who lost? 2. The presbyterian Church started in Greece and moved through Europe about 1500 years ago. There were dissenters to Roman Catholicism before the King Henry. The Greek Orthodox Church broke away from Roman Catholicism many years before the Protestant Reformation. Presbyterianism also commenced in Scotland about a thousand years ago. Iona is the starting point in Western Europe. My presbyterian books also state the same. The Roman Catholic Church is finished as its immoral. Even Bin Laden seen that was the case several years ago. Game over for the Roman Candles.

• seanomelb | May 03, 2012, 10:25 PM EDT

  Well Alan07 I proved to you that Presbyterianism did not start 1000yrs. ago in Iona what more do you want??

• allan07 | May 02, 2012, 03:18 PM EDT

  @seanomelb Columba was a student of religion at Clonard Abbey in Ireland under St. Finnan. When St. Finnan was away Columba copied the manuscripts (in Latin) of Psalms which were important at the time to religious scholars. Before Finnan left it was promised by Columba that he would not copy these manuscripts. On his return St. Finnan found out that Columba had copied them and demanded the copy. Columbia refused and the matter went to court. The king (Diarmait) said "To every cow its calf; to every manuscript its copy". Even after the court case Columba refused to return the copy and columba raised arms against the king. St Brendan was alleged to have spoken on behalf of Columba and it was agreed Columba would go into exile. Before he went into exile a war resulted in 561 at Cul Dreimhne in which over 3000 of Columba family, relatives and suppporters were killed. A few of the kings forces died. Columba went into exile and was granted land at Iona. Far enough away from Ireland so he could not see his homeland. Read Lowells Blog St. Columba and charlesjames hubpages An intellient history website. So Columba lost 3000, the king a few. So Columba was hardly a saint for in effect copying manuscripts which he agreed not to copy, then not returning them.(Even after a judgement by the king). Like I said Saints don't exist on planet earth. Its a myth. I suppose you will find fault with the many sources of history i have used. Whos got a tilted view of history now? Any questions? Roman Catholicism in Ireland are certainly not after the sexual abuse cases and the cover up which followed. Immoral and corrupt the lot.

• allan07 | May 02, 2012, 02:49 PM EDT

  @seanomelb you were married in the Presbyterian Church. Well so was i and baptisted there and did my holy communion there. So thats makes me a presbyterian. But your not as you weren't baptisted there or had holy communion there. The Roman Empire abuses and occupation isn't an anology as you claim its fact. They invaded many European countries causing millions to die over a 500 year period. Brutality, rape, execution of opponents, destruction and many wars. Thats how Roman Catholicism spread throughout Europe by force of arms and occupation. Which part of the truth don't you like. The bare facts perhaps.

• seanomelb | Apr 30, 2012, 07:39 PM EDT

  The roman army analogy is silly you're clutching at straws. Quote me the source which states Colmcille lost the battle!! I really don't care which British king won the battle of the Boyne, you drift into silly data to bolster your false premises and make yourself look foolish.

• allan07 | Apr 30, 2012, 04:40 PM EDT

  @seanomelb by Colmcille you mean St. Columbia. I have got a slanted view of history? So when the Roman Empire invaded quite a few countries in Europe did they seek the opinions of the people whom lived there? No. They used force of arms, a navy and a huge army. Brutality in the extreme. Their religion was forced upon the people and if you didnt like it well death. So Roman Catholicism was spread by occupation by the Roman Empire. Lets face it wasn't it the said pontius pilate the Roman Governor whom imposed taxes upon the people. He also nailed a man called Jesus to the cross. Hardly the behaviour of angels. So the Roman Empire denigrated the Jewish religion. St. Columbia was granted land at Iona but he didnt own it. Not the same thing. He also lost the Battle of Cul Dreimhne thats why he feld to Scotland. I suppose you believe James won the battle of the Boyne on 1st July 1690. Your view of history is a tilted as the north face of the eiger. You should read history but dont change it.

• seanomelb | Apr 29, 2012, 09:11 PM EDT

  I never stated that "saints" were the sole ownership of the Catholic church I don't really care what saint is attached to which religion.I am not a practicing RC and I was married in the Presbyterian church. Unlike you I do not denigrate any religion.I take umbrage to your slanted view of history(or mythology) and your religious bigotry.Colmcille won the battle of Cul Dreimhne and sent king Diarmid packing. I note you accept that the Scottish west was Irish territory at the time. Scottish music and Gaelic are the fruits of the Irish colonisation of Scotland.

• allan07 | Apr 29, 2012, 05:03 PM EDT

  @seanomelb the annals is that written by the Roman Catholic Church? Theres the problem. Surprise surprise they are telling lies when they are all godly saints. Not! In 563 St Columba was granted land of Scotland. Of course he fled Ireland as he quarrelled with Saint Finnian and this led to a battle Cul Dreimjne in 561. Saints are a myth in my opinion. Self gratification to promote a religion. Rubbish and waffle. Saints are not the property of the RC Church however. St. Columbia is held in high esteem within several religions. Anglician Communion, Lutheran Church, Eastern Orthodoxy and yes in my church Presbyterian. But i think its pants. In Omagh County Tyrone the Church of Ireland have a St. Columbia Church. Yes i have even been in there on many occasions even although I am not Church of Ireland. I do refuse to their prayers as its too RC. Anglicians believe in saints. Well theres St. Pauls Cathedral, St. Martins in the Field both in London. Lots of Church of England Schools use saints in their titles. Then theres St. Barts hospital in England. Famous heart hospital. You call me a bigot. Never. I have a open mind. Why do you defend the RC Church as if they were your mother? I will have to find my Presbyterian boks and teach you much. Presbyterianism existed many years before Henry V111. Lots of churches broke away from the Roman Catholic church. Greek orthodoxy did. The Roman Empire simply used brutal force to force their religion onto everyone. It all boils down to control, money and ensuring that they held control for their own well being. To hell with anyone else.

• Paradigm | Apr 29, 2012, 07:43 AM EDT

  What a cosy little 'guilt-avoidance' bunch we have running Ulster. Martin screws Peter privately and Peter says "Martin, shake hands with H.M. - then it will be too embarrassing for the Law to pursue you over your past - look how I got away with it". To think good Ulstermen and women gave their lives for this dishonourable carve-up!

• DanOLoingsigh | Apr 29, 2012, 07:10 AM EDT

  the Venerable Bede, Anglo-Saxon monk and author of ‘the Ecclesiastical History of the English People’ (the foundation-stone of the known history of England,) in about 731 AD, is silent on this matter, so cannot be used as a witness by either side...

• barneyjo | Apr 29, 2012, 05:21 AM EDT

  @allan07 - Catholic Presbyterians are to be feared; worst of the lot :)

• seanomelb | Apr 28, 2012, 08:39 PM EDT

  Allan07 There is no mention in the annals that Ninian ever saw Iona, the writings of Bede and others confirm this.Ninian built his church called "Candida Casa" which is now called whitethorn situated in Galloway. You cannot justify your bigotry by making up fairytales. Even St. Pat mentions St.Ninian and no Iona is mentioned.Remember Iona was part of Dal Riada Ireland's Scottish territory and that is why Iona was given to Colmcille.

• seamus60 | Apr 28, 2012, 08:26 PM EDT

  Poor Niall doesn`t know whether he`s coming or going. all this, only for the man who put him in his place and made him look a total twat earlier in his year of fame, to now get ready himself to suck the glove clean off her (his leaders) hand should he get the chance. Can`t be very nice for Niall, but lay down with the dogs and you know what to expect.

• allan07 | Apr 28, 2012, 07:23 PM EDT

  @barneyjo i fear no-one. Not even death itself. When its your turn its your turn. Like my friend who was shot in the face by the IRA said to me about death before he was murdered "If its meant for you it ain't going to go past you".

• barneyjo | Apr 28, 2012, 06:59 PM EDT

  @Allan07 - See what I mean; there's Catholic Presbyterians all around you. Be afraid, be very afraid :)

• allan07 | Apr 28, 2012, 02:43 PM EDT

  @curitiba so as saints dont exist the whole matter is a farce. So its strange having a British person becoming the saint of Ireland. I thought that the Irish didn't accept the British being on the island of Ireland. Its a good job Sinn Fein were not around back then as he would have been seen as another planter invading Ireland. He would have been labelled a Brit and a hun. @sirpeter i know it hard to accept but the Roman Catholics are just the results of a Roman Empire. The Romans invaded everyone elses country and their religion came with them. Fair enough the British Empire spreaded protestantism. So we are arguing about which empire did the right thing or the wrong thing. Why do not accept that the Roman Empire was just as wrong in their brutality and oppression of the citizens of whatever country they invaded? We hear about the British Empire wrongdoing but nothing about the Roman Empires ill gotten gains. Their brutality and oppression. After all they didnt invade for the good of the citizens whom lived there. They stole, raped, murdered, etc, They were no angels or saints. Like i said saints dont exist here on planet earth.

• allan07 | Apr 28, 2012, 02:26 PM EDT

  @barneyjo as a loyal citizen of Great Britain i dont think i will be locked up in the tower of London. If we talk about everything that might happen it would be a waste of time. How about a meteorite hitting the earth and taking us all out? The only guarantees in life are death and taxes. After that nothing. Thats why the bookies always win. @curitiba I know St. George is the patron saint of Georgia a small country in the eastern europe on the Black Sea. Fair enough. One big point i wish to make is that sainthood is rubbish. Presbyterians dont believe in it. Its simply self gratification. Take Pope John Paul 11 becoming a saint. Who was in charge of the RC Church when the sexual abuses were being covered up? He did know about it all and covered the whole matter up. Why? Because he seen that it would cost the Church compensation having to be paid to the victims. What a scandal? Hardly the behaviour of a saint. At the same time he was preaching about children being abused, the damage caused by commercialism, protecting children in the modern world, famine and how this affected children, disease in african countries and the poor victims were usually children, etc, etc. At the same time the priests of his own organisation were being shielded by the very Church that he was head of. Come on he was no saint. Far from it. When they make up a excuse that he committed a miracle. What miracle? He is supposed to have cured one women of some illness. Hardly a miracle as she wasn't ill to start with. All lies. Well if he had solved the famine in African countries or world poverty fine. But it's all lies. You know it and everybody with common sense knows it. WE and i use the word WE are all sinners. So that makes no one a saint. If your a sinner then you cannot be a saint. It been dreamt up for self gratification and for promoting the Church in a glowing light but its a farce.

• STEVENSTAR | Apr 28, 2012, 12:38 PM EDT

  TO ALL AMERICANS ON HERE CAN YOU PLEASE STOP INTERFERING IN IRISH POLITICS ITS GOT NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU.. WE ARE 1000S AND 1000S OF MILES AWAY FROM AMERICA A DIFFERENT CULTURE DIFFERENT PEOPLE AND A 5 - 8 HOUR TIME DIFFERENCE TO YOU PEOPLE ... PLEASE GET MORE INVOLVED IN YOUR OWN POLITICAL AFFAIRS AND SORT THEM OUT .. THANKS STEVEN IN CORK IN IRELAND ..

• Curitiba | Apr 28, 2012, 09:04 AM EDT

  allan07: St Patrick wasn't English, he was British, there wasn't any such thing as England then. Also, St George, who features on your flag and who is the patron saint of England, was born in Palestine. So Ireland is not the only country that needed to import a patron saint.

• sirpeter | Apr 28, 2012, 08:36 AM EDT

  Allan07.You are so mixed up it's unbelievable.I take it with a surname like Allan, which is pure Celtic origin that you are of Scottish Presbyterian decent.The fact is your ancestors for a thousand years spoke Scots Gaelic and not English.You see Allan with an A.You are of Celtic blood.Allen with an E is the Anglicized version.But that's still Celtic in origin too.You are spitting on your dead ancestors who knew who they were and fought the English.You're family gave up their true identity to become subjects of the United Kingdom.Which in truth means loyal lapdogs to your conqueror England.How your Scottish ancestors must turn in their graves every time you comment on IC.This might surprise you but my mother's name is Allan (very rare down south) with an A as well and of Scottish Presbyterian decent(Dundee).They were never loyal to England.They had William Wallace blood in their veins.For some people been subjects/british is just another word for house nig*er.

• barneyjo | Apr 28, 2012, 07:01 AM EDT

  Allan07 - Hey, dont shoot the Messenger!! I never once said that this is the way that things WILL be, but rather how things COULD be; nothing more. I have to confess that I am old enough to remember the Nash/ Watt fight, and clearly the better man won on the night; I'm as much a sportsman as the next man and the best man should always win. I dont do the lottery; its the Presbyterian blood in me that wont allow me to (Yeah, even I have a little of that in me also!!)and you know the saying "better to be pennywise than pound foolish!! And you're missing the boat when it comes to speaking cupla focal (a couple of words) in Irish. Bhanrion Eilis a Dho (Queen Elizabeth) was moved to speak in Irish on the occasion of her State visit to Ireland last year, and guess what, the sky didnt fall on her head. And more recently (yesterday I think) the Duke & Duchess of Cornwall (Charles & Camilla) were presented with two copies of the Book of Common Prayer, one in English, one in Irish during a visit to St Georges Church of Ireland in Belfast. According to a report in the Belfast Newsletter, they met with members of the congregation which included representatives of the Church of Ireland Irish Language Guild. The paper reports that Prince Charles said he would like to learn the Irish language, I imagine to compliment his knowledge of Scots Gaelic and Welsh which are also native languages of these islands. So I'd be careful about who you diss for speaking Irish, in case you get locked up in the Tower of London for treason or something similar :)UND AUCH, ICH KANN DEUTSCH, FRANZOSICH, UND ALEMAN SPRECHEN, GANZ GUT. Sie haben die Wahl!!

• barneyjo | Apr 28, 2012, 06:42 AM EDT

  Allan07 - Hey, dont shoot the Messenger!! I never once said that this is the way that things WILL be, but rather how things COULD be; nothing more. I have to confess that I am old enough to remember the Nash/ Watt fight, and clearly the better man won on the night; I'm as much a sportsman as the next man and the best man should always win. I dont do the lottery; its the Presbyterian blood in me that wont allow me to (Yeah, even I have a little of that in me also!!)and you know the saying "better to be pennywise than pound foolish!! And you're missing the boat when it comes to speaking cupla focal (a couple of words) in Irish. Bhanrion Eilis a Dho (Queen Elizabeth) was moved to speak in Irish on the occasion of her State visit to Ireland last year, and guess what, the sky didnt fall on her head. And more recently (yesterday I think) the Duke & Duchess of Cornwall (Charles & Camilla) were presented with two copies of the Book of Common Prayer, one in English, one in Irish during a visit to St Georges Church of Ireland in Belfast. According to a report in the Belfast Newsletter, they met with members of the congregation which included representatives of the Church of Ireland Irish Language Guild. The paper reports that Prince Charles said he would like to learn the Irish language, I imagine to compliment his knowledge of Scots Gaelic and Welsh which are also native languages of these islands. So I'd be careful about who you diss for speaking Irish, in case you get locked up in the Tower of London for treason or something similar :)

• allan07 | Apr 28, 2012, 05:31 AM EDT

  @seanomelb Iona was first created by St. Ninian about 400AD. St. Columba did indeed go to Iona some time later. The Presbyterian Church originally started in greece and moved west through Europe. The Roman rulers oppressed anyone with a different set of ideals or beliefs from that of the Roman Catholic Church. Nothing has changed over time. If you dont agree with the RC Church then its conflict and oppression. I have many books that state that the Presbyterian Church started in Greece. In fact the word "Presbyterian" in greek means elder. Iona is the start of the presbyterian Church in Scotland. In the bible Acts 14.23, 20.17 and Titus 1.5 it mentions the presbyterians whom opposed the Roman Empire and their beliefs (Presbyterians). These people had to flee as they were oppressed by the Roman Empire and Church. In Scotland the presbyterian Church is the largest church. (I think). St Patrick according to Wikipedia was born in Glannoventa near Ravenglass Cumbria England. So hes actually English. So fancy the patron saint of Ireland being a Englishman. Can't the Irish find one of their own? That must be a bitter blow to accept for nationalists. Apparently there are two authentic letters that exist today which were written by him. St. Patrick apparently was kidnapped by Irish raiders when he was in Wales and taken back as a hostage. The plot thickens. Irish people kidnapping and robbing. Obviously the fore runner to the Irish Republican Brotherhood. No change there then. I think you should read the Church of Scotland website. 48 kings of Scotland are buried there. Some Irish Kings are also buried there. If you want me to get out my presbyterian history books i can. John Knox and Calvin modernised the church in the 16th century but they did not start it. Its was there before they existed. Started by the victims of the Roman Catholic Church and the Roman Empire. Death, oppression and brutality caused them to flee.

• allan07 | Apr 28, 2012, 04:47 AM EDT

  @sirpeter you will be surprised that i dont speak gaelic. Foreign language to me. Its what i was told by those who do speak gaelic. Its a waste of time learning it an any case as its not of any value in the 21st century. Some people may have learnt Latin in the past but time moves on. It may be useful if your a doctor or into plants and gardening. I would rather learn German, French or Spanish.

• allan07 | Apr 28, 2012, 04:41 AM EDT

  @barneyjo you play a typical SF game. Predicting the future acting as if your mystic meg. Looking into your crystal ball and making statements as if they are going to happen. Well why not predict something that is going to change your life if your so good at predicting the future. Didn't you predict the Euro lottery last night correctly. £36 million. No you didnt cause it was won by a spanish citizen. The predicting game is usually incorrect. I remember those who predicted at the start of World War 1 that in the summer of 1914 who predicted that it would all be over by Christmas. Didnt happen. Some have predicted the end of the world this year. Well if we are here 1st January 2013 that will also be incorrect. If you can predict so well then lets be having the Euro Lottery numbers for next tuesday. Then there was a certain Mr Charlie Nash from the bogside a few year back who predicted he would give his opponent Jim Watt a good beating to take his World boxing title. Yes Nash put him down but unfortunely Jim Watt got back up and the rest is history. Why pretend your mystic meg when its clearly not the case? Even she got the sack from Camelot as she was always wrong. Its all part of the SF game. One minute they are friendly, then nasty, then mind games, a bit of predicting, a bit of spin, then looking for a story to stir the pot of hate and division, going through all the cards in the pack to attempt to confuse and plant seeds of doubt in everyones mind. Childist behaviour acting like a 5 year old who is demanding sweets from a parent. "I am going to cry until i get my sweets, i want my sweets, i ain't going to eat anything until i get MY sweets". Grow up.

• seanomelb | Apr 27, 2012, 11:41 PM EDT

  allan07 Iona was set up by St. Colmcille(an Irish monk) almost 1500 years ago,the land was given to him by the king of Ulster to build a church and Christianize the Pict's and there was not a presbyterian in sight.BTW I never stated that good old Henry started Protestantism as that would be incorrect.Presbyterians claim that their religion was started around 1560 (Scottish Reformation)although others claim Calvin as the founder of the church(18th. century) therefore old pat was not a protestant and Henry did begin the reformation,but did not necessarily begin the protestant church.

• sirpeter | Apr 27, 2012, 04:32 PM EDT

  AllanO7.You are assimilating nicely,I must say.Explaining your hometown in Irish.But again you even got that wrong. Druim - [OIr., ridge]. Prefix in many OIr. place-names denoting a highland or highlands or gentle slopes; often anglicized Drum - or Drom.But Allan "quin" is not village in Irish .Let me educate you once again.The town Drumquin is named after what the area looked like. Druim Caoin/Drumquin, means "Caoin~pleasant/gentle, Druim~ridge/hill")Drumquin means gentle/pleasant hill.NOT "The village amongst the hills"

• barneyjo | Apr 27, 2012, 03:20 PM EDT

  @Allan07 - well, if my view of the world is of no interest to you "Zip and even zero" I take it as a real compliment that you bothered to respond at all. So by all means, you keep right on ignoring me and my comments, and I'll keep on shaking the tree and see what falls out:) Oh and if you think this is typical Sinn Fein rubbish, you'd better remind those members of Parliament in London, and the Assemblies in Cardiff and Edinburgh who are all members of the British/Irish Council who meet to find ways to improve the lives of all our peoples that they are "dancing to the Sinn Fein tune" And I also see in the papers that an agreement has been reached between Belfast and Dublin that anyone who is a registered member of their local library in either NI or ROI can use ANY library in Ireland, north or south. Does Drumquinn? have a library tell me and if so are you a member? I'll leave it to you to organise the burning of membership cards in protest at the creation of the latest in a long line of "Cross Border" Institutions; assuming that there are any residents of Drumquinnn who are members of the library in the first place!!

• allan07 | Apr 27, 2012, 02:46 PM EDT

  @barneyjo sorry to confuse you "YOUR OPINIONS ARE OF NO INTEREST TO ME" NONE, ZIP AND EVEN ZERO.

• allan07 | Apr 27, 2012, 02:44 PM EDT

  @barneyjo why do you worry what other people should think? Why talk rubbish? What other people think is of no concern to you. The last time i looked this was a free country. Your attempts to brain wash everyone who opposes you is wasted energy. Typical SF rubbish. What other people think personally i dont give a flying frog. Like I said its a free country. Your opinions are of interest to me.

• allan07 | Apr 27, 2012, 02:38 PM EDT

  @barneyjo your nasty comments dont upset me. It just shows you for what you are. Some stupid idiots done deserve any comment. I will apply this rule to you with honour. How many Gold medals will the Republic get at the Olympics? None same as last time. Team GB will get 30 Gold. Who wants to be part of zero. Only idiots and clowns.

• allan07 | Apr 27, 2012, 02:32 PM EDT

  This story is so untruthful it shows thats it been written by a bigot. Firstly the title refers to Queen Elizabeth 11 as the Queen of England. Incorrect. It refers to her as the English monarch. Incorrect. British monarch. It refers to the English throne. Incorrect. British throne. Even today the Queen has visited Wales to the site of a tragedy back in 1966 when 114 souls lost their lifes. The vast majority of them children. Well done the Queen of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Very caring and compassion shown today.

• tomasocarthaigh | Apr 27, 2012, 02:18 PM EDT

  A bit of common sense... and the DUP stepped up to the plate with a few snide remarks about how the functions of both sides should be celebrated by the Lord Mayor... but it is the best option for all. The North of Ireland will move on.

• barneyjo | Apr 27, 2012, 02:00 PM EDT

  @SirPeter - One day, perhaps years from now, the boul Allan07,still clutching his tattered Union Flag will take a chance and finally stick his head above the sandbags in his mind to have a look at the battlefield to see how things stand. I think when he realises that he is the only one who is still trying to reach the future through the past and that everyone else actually has, he may start to wonder WTF has actually happened. Questions like "where did the All Ireland international Soccer team come from?" or "how come Jeffery Donaldson is the Grand Old Man of Ulster Unionism representing his constituents within a Federal Ireland in both Belfast and Dublin?" may cross his mind. And it will be at that point he will have to make the choice; what does he do next? :)

• allan07 | Apr 27, 2012, 11:30 AM EDT

  @TayandCake yes the Free State are in the Euro Championship. But for how long? They are only making up the numbers. St. Patrick was a Frenchman. Well he wasn't born in Ireland. De Valera was an American (born in New York). Of spanish descent. (His mother was Irish but left many years before her son was born). A pair of Plastic Paddys. Unlike myself I was born in Drumquin. (Drum as in hill, quin as in village). The village amongst the hills. If De Valera or St. Patrick were alive today i would tell the pair to piss off out of my country. Bloody foreigners. Planting themselves in Ireland. How dare they!

• allan07 | Apr 27, 2012, 11:22 AM EDT

  @seanomelb let me correct you with your inaccurate statements. Protestantism existed before the 15th Century. Before Henry V111 of England was even dreamt of. My Church the Presbyternian Church is about a 1000 years old. The Ancient site of Iona in Scotland is the site of the first church in Western Europe. Most of the ancient kings of Scotland are buried there. The former leader of the labour party in GB (John Smith) is buried there. I know all Roman Catholics believe that protestantism was created by Henry V111 wanting to divorce from his first wife. For some yes thats true but Presbyternians existed 500 years before that. You should learn the facts before quoting inaccurate material.

• allan07 | Apr 27, 2012, 11:09 AM EDT

  @STEVENSTAR Thats two words 1. Fat. 2. Twat. Cant you count? Saying that @IrelandNorth is also very confused. He has said on another topic that hes an elder in the Presbyternian Church and thats hes also half a Roman Catholic. Very confused soul. Although I believe hes also a jews rabbi on a Friday, Muslim Cleric on Saturdays, Roman Catholic on Sunday (morning only) he attends the Free Presbyternian Church for evening prayers of course, Baptist, Jehovah Witness, Brethren, Plymouth Brethren the rest of the week. (Thats when hes not practising Buddhism and Hiduism). He a good example of not knowing anything as hes so confused. I also believe he dresses up a woman at the weekends. He used to be decisive but now hes not so sure! Give the poor lad some time to make his mind up!

• sirpeter | Apr 27, 2012, 10:11 AM EDT

  @Barneyjo.On the other hand I would think Allan07 might not be as loyalist as he portrays.The very fact some Unionists comment on this site is promising.Of course my comments towards them don't help at times ;))But some of their comments are a downright figment of their imagination.They don't even bother to Google the facts.As Allan says St Patrick was a french protestant,a protestant like himself ;));))How does one respond to that?

• STEVENSTAR | Apr 27, 2012, 08:31 AM EDT

  @@@IrelandNorth | A pr 27, 2012, 07:56 AM EDT .... ONE WORD FOR YOU AND THATS =FAT TWAT !!!!

• IrelandNorth | Apr 27, 2012, 07:56 AM EDT

  STEVENSTAR! Thanks, mate! Appreciate your empathy. May go up North for the Glorious 12th o' July? Do ya suppose they'd have a spare sash for a 'southern' fluffy-Fenian (ex-Papist-idolator) like myself? I'm all for cultural diversity - ya know! DanOLoingsigh! No offence intended apropos the BB epithet. Realised it was a largely working class loyalist term, since they sing it at their soccer matches regularly. Being self-conferred, I assumed it to be complimentary? Mea maxima culpa! PS. Have never been a patient man. Always envied orthodox Christians their Jobian patience in awaiting the return of their Messiah. But waiting for my fellow countrymen to co-create a Wolfe-Tonian republic is taking it toll. Still, having spiritually evolved to the synthesis of the Theolbaldian religious dialectic, I await in joyful hope for the coming of a heterodox republic, even if post-dating a post-Gorian inconvenient truth of hell freezing over.

• seanomelb | Apr 26, 2012, 09:23 PM EDT

  There seems to be a jealous streak running through stevenstar and allan07.They hate any gains made by Irish sportsmen/politician or business people on the international stage. Allan07 claims old Pat was a protestant.Protestantism is a product of the 15th.century and the French bit who cares we really do not know where he was born. I firmly believe tat stevenstar has a mental problem and needs our love to carry him through life, the poor man.

• STEVENSTAR | Apr 26, 2012, 07:07 PM EDT

  IN IRELAND EVERYONE WATCHES BBC AND BRITISH TV WE READ BRITISH NEWSPAPERS SHOP IN BRITISH SHOPS AND FOLLOW BRITISH SPORT THE IRISH AND BRITISH ARE VERY INTERTWINED MORE SO THEN AMERICANS LIKE TO THINK AS AN IRISHMAN I FEEL MUCH MORE OF AN AFFILIATION WITH BRITISH PEOPLE MORE SO THEN ANY OTHER COUNTRY IN EUROPE .. AND FEEL MOST IRISH ONLY LIKE AMERICAN TOURISTS WHEN THEN COME AND SPEND THEIR $$$$4 OUTSIDE OF THAT IRISH PEOPLE HAVE NO TIME FOR AMERICANS AND FIDN THEM QUIET BORING AND SPOILED AND LAZY ALWAYS COMPLAINING ABOUT THE WEATHER AND TALKING ABOT THEIR GREAT AUNTY MARY WAS IRISH = HOW BORING IS THAT !!!

• TayandCake | Apr 26, 2012, 05:38 PM EDT

  Wee Allan07, you're about as logical as a glass hammer, at least the Rep are in the Euro cup. Look in the phone book, Oh FFS, thats how you put your point across, there really is no hope for you now lad, you're lost in a cesspit of unintelligent babbling. St Patrick is French now? who gave you your education, the teletubbies? Saddo

• sirpeter | Apr 26, 2012, 05:14 PM EDT

  ancavker.Irish and English ways are both intertwined.Also both countries are influenced by American culture.What English ways are you talking about?And why would it be better?I have teenagers and if anything they have been influenced by American culture not English.Alot more American TV than English TV.So U2 the biggest band in the world over the last 30 years is nothing to admire musically?So the English don't admire Irish literature?William Butler Yeats, George Bernard Shaw, Samuel Beckett and Seamus Heaney to name a few.Guinness is world famous.English Ale is better too? I think not.Riverdance??I didn't see any English Country Dance doing much.Irish technology,pharmaceuticals,software are all cutting edge and sophisticated.Is St Georges day better that St Patricks Day which again is worldwide.What about our Celtic holiday Halloween?We didn't influence the Saxon at all? I'll be honest.Besides looking at English soccer teams on TV where most players are foreigners.I don't think the Irish give much thought to English ways.You are going to have to explain that one to me.So English ways/Culture is better? Maybe you could explain this fab modern English culture.I must be missing something.I bet the yanks here are all ears too.

• barneyjo | Apr 26, 2012, 04:18 PM EDT

  @Sirpeter - It would seem that in the case of Allan07 your case is proven; he is wholly dillusional about "Norn Iron" and he obviously sees something entirely different than most other people. When he talks about Drumquin, its a village on the road from nowhere to somewheres else!! I cant imagine that Allan07 will be supporting those from his community who are playing Gaelic Football in increasing numbers. There are those within Alan07s community who can see Gaelic football for what it is; a sport, without any political statement. And I note also that Glentoran and DERRY CITY (More Caps there Allan07 :) are due to play in the Seateanta Cup final in Belfast this week. So Allan07 can continue to live in his own little yesterworld when the real one moves on!! (We'll wait for you to catch up Allan07)!!

• ancavker | Apr 26, 2012, 03:33 PM EDT

  sirpter: They are alike, because so many of the Irish look to and admire English ways/culture if you will. You may disagree but I see it with my own family. In many Irish people's mind if it is English, it is better, modern, sophisticated.

• DanOLoingsigh | Apr 26, 2012, 03:14 PM EDT

  Ireland North – I can’t speak for the Billy Boys, as you call them, but if you want your fellow countrymen to buy into a UI, I suggest you drop such offensive terms, and try to persuade them to join…part of the ‘driver’ for the original partition was the fear of their fate as a minority within a nationalist Ireland…a fear that was not assuaged by any nationalist politicians, except possibly William O’Brien and his ‘All for Ireland’ party…his policy of "Conference, Conciliation and Consent" may have won over enough unionists, but his views were ignored by the mainstream nationalist politicians, with the consequences we live with today…

• allan07 | Apr 26, 2012, 03:13 PM EDT

  Have you all missed me? It good to add some logic and sense to this discussion. Thats a discussion I say and not negotations to the left footers. @Brendan Kearns get over it Northern Ireland is a legal separate and wholly independent country. Your Football team will be kicked out of the Euro Championship in the Summer by Italy, Croatia and Spain. Why cant your lot just stick to GAA as it was invented by your lot to prevent your lot from playing foreign sports such as Football, Cricket and Rugby. @STEVENSTAR get rid of the capitals. Its so aggressive. Press the button marked Caps Lock. Its on the left hand side of the keyboard. Thats right the same side as your big left foot you left footer. Lets get serious I was born in Drumquin, County Tyrone, NORTHERN IRELAND. Sorry i used the caps. Thats NORTHERN IRELAND. So you dont know what your talking about. I am not an Americian as you have claimed. NO WAY. Unionist, Loyalist, Protestant, Northern Irish, Yes all of these but always 100% BRITISH. GOD SAVE OUR QUEEN HER HEIRS AND SUCCESSORS. NO SURRENDER. 1690 AND ALL THAT. @Brendan Kearns get the facts correct. Queen Elizabeth 11 is not the Queen of England. Queen Elizabeth 11 is Queen of Great Britain and NORTHERN IRELAND, Head of the Commonwealth, Head of the Church of England, etc. @TayandCake You dont think Nixon and Taft are Irish Names. Look in the telephone directory. De Valera was hardly a Irishman. He was a Plastic Paddy. He was born in New York USA and of Spanish descent. Hence his name. Even St Patrick was a Frenchman. A protestant like myself and hes buried in DownPatrick NORTHERN IRELAND. Sorry my caps lock get stuck. Love you all.

• barneyjo | Apr 26, 2012, 09:43 AM EDT

  @IrelandNorth - Nice Theory................!!!!

• STEVENSTAR | Apr 26, 2012, 08:55 AM EDT

  @@IrelandNorth | Apr 26, 2012, 08:53 AM EDT >>>>> YOU NEED A HOLIDAY TO CHILL OUT MATE !!

• IrelandNorth | Apr 26, 2012, 08:53 AM EDT

  The Good Friday Agreement allows for a referendum in both [artificial] jurisdictions on the island of Ireland re. reunification. What will the Billy Boys online do if and when 50% plus one voter in both such jurisdictions vote for a United Ireland. Will they, like their forefathers, redefine Northern Ireland (i.e. repartition)? Will they exclude the 'Catholic' counties like the Boundary Commission to manufacture an artificial majority? If Home Rule is no longer Rome rule, what will the excuse be then? Against the backdrop of a dis-United Kingdom of Great Britain post Scottish (and Welsh?) independence and growing English republicanism, how viable will a United Kingdom of England and County Antrim be? Ulster unionists will NOT be forced into a united Ireland. They will be attracted, cajolled, or enticed into it. And if all else fails, they will be economically compromised like the rest of Ireland was into the European Union by the International Monetary Fund and European Central Bank. Seems economics trumps democracy every time? A civil war is a war between two opposing factions of the same country. I'm glad those who say a united Ireland will lead to one recognise the inherent integrity of the Irish nation, albeit it somewhat melodramatically. A United Ireland will be less painful than Ulster-Scot mythology have led them to believe. Why not join the 100,000 other Britons in the rest of Ireland? And allow us all to have a more organic and holisitic relationship with the neighbouring island.

• sirpeter | Apr 25, 2012, 10:17 PM EDT

  Barneyjo.Without a doubt you will find those traits on both sides.But there is a difference between NI and the Republic when it comes to those traits.Take Dano's argument.There was very real and active discrimination against the Catholic working class in NI in all aspects of economic and political life.Protestants in the Republic were not exposed to discrimination anywhere near the levels that the Catholics were in economic or political life after independence.The fact of the matter is nothing really changed.The law upheld protestant ownership of whatever they had.Only people who act in a tyrannical way fear that the same will be done to them.Every German in Stalingrad thought if they surrendered they were going to be shot by the Russians out of hand and that was only because of the cruelty the Germans did behind the lines.Now I'll defend the Prods and say a fear is as good as reality if you are unsure of the outcome.lol.

• seanomelb | Apr 25, 2012, 08:14 PM EDT

  Try telling a unionist that a dying Carson regretted the partition of Ireland. Britain always feared a strong Ireland and partition is a symptom of national weakness on both sides of the border. A unified Ireland would be more secular and economically better off. How much longer can England pour millions into the north before their citizens scream "look after us first" especially now that England is back in recession.

• barneyjo | Apr 25, 2012, 05:38 PM EDT

  @sir-peter - in my experience you will find those traits on both sides of the "divide" but certainly more exposed within sections of the Unionist Community. I mean, try convincing a dyed in the wool Loyalist from east Belfast that Edward Carson was a de-facto founding father of modern Gaelic sports and see how far you get. Incidentally, the local BBC news in Belfast ran a feature this evening on local protestant kids competing in a GAA sponsored competition for communities new to the sport. They were having a blast, and not one political undercurrent in sight :)

• Gearoid4 | Apr 25, 2012, 04:59 PM EDT

  Well if it is not an Island nation, then how can we set the bounds to it, Dan? The whole Island of Ireland had a mainly uniform culture and language from the pre-Christian period up to the 16th Century, when the Tudor conquests overwhelmed the truly heroic resistance of the Ulster chieftains. The unions did dissent from various attempts by British governments to usher in 3 home rule bills in the late 19th and early 20th centuries. This did mean that there was local resistance to recognition of any kind of all-Ireland autonomy but partition was enforced without any Irish plebiscite and the border commission's findings in 1924-25 were so biased in favor of unionism, that it was a joke.

• sirpeter | Apr 25, 2012, 04:38 PM EDT

  Barneyjo.Actually I was going to say for people to take it easy on him.It did look like he was under siege with all the comments directed at him :)).They like when you put them under siege.I respect their culture ;))It's a culture of been different when there isn't any meaningful difference.They will also manoeuvre all reasonable engagement into some sort of siege in the end anyway.The stuff they say is so off the wall that it appears to me that it is not a question of right or wrong or weather it's the truth or not.Or which version of history is correct.That doesn't seem to matter.Not one bit.It's about been different.It seems they are programmed from birth with a belief that they are so different.That is all that matters to them.When the reality is the people (Ireland & the UK) are so alike.They comment here for reassurance that they are different.Unfortunately

• DanOLoingsigh | Apr 25, 2012, 03:49 PM EDT

  Gearoid4 - surely the island is called Ireland, not the nation...The nationalists of Ireland did not want to be a downtrodden minority in a larger state...the unionists felt just the same, and made their decision on that basis...to say that partition was enforced from outside is not quite accurate - Ulster Covenant and all that...The great enemy of clear language is insincerity...

• ArmaghCity | Apr 25, 2012, 03:44 PM EDT

  @ByTheBay ... answer my earlier inquiry plese. Have you experienced The Troubles first-hand, i.e., from residing in the northern six, or do you write your "expertise" to us, as I suspect, from your far away home in the free-state or in America? Sorry to break the news to you mate, but you do NOT speak for all Irish, so please stop flattering yourself by thinking you do. Collins gave up six counties to free 26. It was a stepping stone. The GFA was another stepping stone. You obviously think these things happen overnight. So, so clueless.

• Gearoid4 | Apr 25, 2012, 01:58 PM EDT

  It seems like certain contributors on this site would have us believe that the ancient nation called Ireland is concomitant with the land area called the "Republic of Ireland". This is patently false as any decent atlas would tell you or any dispassionate analysis of Irish history for the a thousand years or more before partition. It is an Orwellian abuse of language to portray the reality of enforced partition by a foreign colonial power as anything else. Where are Ireland's national saints reputed to be buried? The answer is in Downpatrick, Co. Down. This place happens to be in the northern jurisdiction ruled by the British, which consists of 6 Ulster counties and this northern province has long been regarded as the most "Irish" part of Ireland where the Irish Gaelic language and culture flourished for 1,500 years or more. Where is Ireland's ecclesiastical capital located? It happens to be Armagh in co. Armagh which again is in "northern Ireland". There you have it. It also so reminiscent of the Humpty Dumpty quote from "Alice Through The Looking-Glass"- 'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, 'it means just what I choose it to mean — neither more nor less.'

• FallsRNat | Apr 25, 2012, 12:52 PM EDT

  youse bandy around names like Wolfe Tone who wanted an Irish Free state, if he were alive today he wouldn't recognise what he fought for, the vitriolic abuse countenanced at the views of a protestant would have him scurrying back to France, no 1916 patriot would have any truck with what has happened in the 26 counties.

• Bythebay | Apr 25, 2012, 11:12 AM EDT

  IrelandNorth, you left Ireland in the 1980's, all you are is a bigot, and all you want to do is continue your prejudice. No mate, Ireland isn't part of that. There is no place for you and your ilk in today's Ireland or in Ireland's interaction with the United Kingdom.

• barneyjo | Apr 25, 2012, 11:08 AM EDT

  @sirpeter et al - dont be too hard on allan07; not his fault. There are many from loyalist and republican communities who think exactly the same. To greater or lesser extent, we've all been victims of our "SHARED" history. Up North in particular. Wasn't it Paul Brady who wrote the words "Up here we sacrafice our children, to feed the worn out dreams of yesterday" There are regular posters on IC (and elswhere) that readily underpin that particular maxim. So, no, go easy on Allan07. Engage with him by all means, but dont put him under siege than he already is in his own mind. Sieges should be lifted, not laid :)

• Bythebay | Apr 25, 2012, 11:04 AM EDT

  ArmaghCity, you wanted "Brits out" and a "United Ireland", you got nil on both. Sinn Fein members elected to Westminister don't even take their seats while collecting salaries and expenses, you have NOT achieved representation. You refused to join the RUC because it was British, the IRA continues to murder Catholic PSNI officers, attempt murder on their parents and discourage Catholics from joining. You refuse to participate in your own country just as you refused to do so 40 years ago because it's part of the United Kingdom. Instead you wall yourself off and fly Ireland's flag, not your own. Then you complain about inequality. Mate, any inequality you imagine is of your own creation. Thanks to you Ireland had to relinquish all claim to Northern Ireland. Grow up. This is 2012. You LOST. There will never be a United Ireland. It's well done and over. The millions of pounds you had squandered on death and destruction could have been used for schools and hospitals, jobs. You're useless and have been useless. Time for you to go away.

• sirpeter | Apr 25, 2012, 10:44 AM EDT

  LOL.Our resident Unionist is under siege.A position he is quite comfortable with.

• ArmaghCity | Apr 25, 2012, 10:30 AM EDT

  @barneyjo ... so very well said, thank you. I agree on all points. Like Casement, Wolfe Tone was a Protestant as well.

• STEVENSTAR | Apr 25, 2012, 10:06 AM EDT

  @@@@@IrelandNorth | Apr 25, 2012, 09:02 AM EDT As an Irishman from Leinster/Eastern Ireland (AND NOT A 48 YEAR OLD ULSTER/NORTHERN IRELAND BACHELOR LIVING AND WORKING AS AN ACCOUNTANT IN THE SOUTHCOAST OF ENGLAND POSTING UNDER A FLAG OF CONVENIENCE), I welcome the cordial relationship between our two countries - Ireland and the United Kingdom of Great Britain (UKGB). The Irish national anthem - Abhrann na b'Fhiann is very beautiful, though may need some lyrical tweaking. The Sash My Father Wore (or the moustache my mother wore for that matter) is catchy too! Yes, Allan! I lived through the Troubles in Ireland. I was in Dublin as a teenager when the Dublin (and Monaghan) carbombs were detonated by Loyalist paramilitaries - with British military assistance! Her Majesty (and Her military attachet in Dublin) can salute the Irish flag and anthem. If you're loyal, you can too. I regret your characteristic defensiveness necessitates that you see me as a foreigner. Your people have been on the island of Ireland for over 300 years. Don't ya think it's about time you got to know your neighbours. P.S. There are no laces in moccassins!>>>>>>>>>>>>>> YOU ARE NO MORE AN IRISHMAN OR LIVE IN IRELAND MATE THEN IM ON THE MOON.......... THE WORDS YOU USE AND THE LANGUAGE IN ALL YOUR WACKY POSTS TELL ME YOUR AMERICAN .... TRYING TO BE IRISH YOU SAD GIT !!! AND THEN YOU SAID IM ALAN BCAUSE THAT GUY ALSO REALISES YOUR A NUT JOB ....

• IrelandNorth | Apr 25, 2012, 09:02 AM EDT

  As an Irishman from Leinster/Eastern Ireland (AND NOT A 48 YEAR OLD ULSTER/NORTHERN IRELAND BACHELOR LIVING AND WORKING AS AN ACCOUNTANT IN THE SOUTHCOAST OF ENGLAND POSTING UNDER A FLAG OF CONVENIENCE), I welcome the cordial relationship between our two countries - Ireland and the United Kingdom of Great Britain (UKGB). The Irish national anthem - Abhrann na b'Fhiann is very beautiful, though may need some lyrical tweaking. The Sash My Father Wore (or the moustache my mother wore for that matter) is catchy too! Yes, Allan! I lived through the Troubles in Ireland. I was in Dublin as a teenager when the Dublin (and Monaghan) carbombs were detonated by Loyalist paramilitaries - with British military assistance! Her Majesty (and Her military attachet in Dublin) can salute the Irish flag and anthem. If you're loyal, you can too. I regret your characteristic defensiveness necessitates that you see me as a foreigner. Your people have been on the island of Ireland for over 300 years. Don't ya think it's about time you got to know your neighbours. P.S. There are no laces in moccassins!

• barneyjo | Apr 25, 2012, 06:34 AM EDT

  @allan07 - Not that long ago, a member of your own Unionist Community (from Loyalist North Belfast I believe) gave you a very worthwhile piece of advice. And that was that you should NOT tar all posters on this site who disagree with you with the one brush. Since our encounters on IC I have come across your musings and views from time to time and it is regrettable to note that you obviously threw that good advice out of the window; and more's the pity because it means that those who are interested in a genuine debate are not going to treat you seriously to do so. Like many others, be they Loyalists or Republican, you fall into the trap of believing that your version of history is right and that others are wrong. And it is simply not the case. Lord Edward Carson, the Father of Unionism was a Dubliner, who played Gaelic Sports and was influential in the formulation of the rules for the modern game of Hurling. Sir Roger Casement, who smuggled guns for the Irish Republican Brotherhood before the 1916 Rising, was a Protestant and an Old Boy of Ballymena Academy.He worked for the British Foreign and Commonwealth Office in London. By your condemnation of one version of History, you are condemning your own. which is very disappointing coming from someone with a "First in Economics" :)

• sirpeter | Apr 25, 2012, 03:50 AM EDT

  Allan07.When will we see this intelligence? You're very economic in showing us.

• TayandCake | Apr 24, 2012, 08:34 PM EDT

  wee ALLAN, you're about as intelligent as a piece of rotten, dried, smelly rat dung, not very. Everyone and their dog have a first in some subject. Ever hear the saying, footballs played on the park not on paper. Seeing your opinion of economics and the world in general and reading that you have a first in economics, I fear you either stole it, made it up or the university/college ya went to is pants.

• seanomelb | Apr 24, 2012, 07:39 PM EDT

  Thee is one German marching song I like allan07 Fahren gegen Engeland.Tell me man in your independent country of Norn Areland who is the minister of foreign affairs how many embassies do you have abroad.Did you know that the Norn Areland tourist office works out of the republic of Ireland's embassies maybe that's because you have no embassies.Gooday!! you egregious little man.

• allan07 | Apr 24, 2012, 02:55 PM EDT

  @ArmaghCity i have a first in economics. I disagree with you in saying that I quite intelligent I AM VERY INTELLIGENT.

• allan07 | Apr 24, 2012, 02:53 PM EDT

  @NorthernIreland I live in NORTHERN IRELAND and yes the soldiers song is offensive to the protestant people. You might as well play a Nazi song at a jews festive occasion. Its a IRA song and NO we will never accept it as anything different. Its offensive. Have you lived through the troubles here in Northern Ireland? NO. Dont tell how me to tie up my laces until you have walk a mile in my shoes. You may not find it offensive but the majority of people in Northern Ireland do. Your opinion DOES NOT MATTER. Your a foreigner and to me you might as well be chinese.

• ArmaghCity | Apr 24, 2012, 02:41 PM EDT

  @ScotchTommy ... um, how old are you?

• ArmaghCity | Apr 24, 2012, 02:40 PM EDT

  Very happy to see the Shinners continued climb in the polls.

• ArmaghCity | Apr 24, 2012, 02:38 PM EDT

  @ByTheBay ... you are like a broken record. While I am not an advocate of most of what happened during The Troubles, you are WRONG to say that it accomplished "nothing". Are the Catholics as discriminated against today as they were in 1969? Is the PSNI comprised almost entirely of Protestants as the RUC was in 1969? Do you think these, and so many many other, changes would have occurred if the nationalist community simply stood down and let the blatant discrimination against them (us) continue? I'm very curious if you've even experienced the Troubles first-hand, or do you write to us from the South, or from America. Stop writing as if you write on behalf of all Irish. You do not speak for me, or for so many, many others.

• Scotchtommy | Apr 24, 2012, 01:53 PM EDT

  I am shocked to see that there has not been a word of sympathy for the poor woman.I refer of course to poor Mrs Dumbgulley who has to wake up ever morning next to the Unacceptable Face of Northern Ireland

• Bythebay | Apr 24, 2012, 11:08 AM EDT

  The more of the shinners that step down, the better it will be.

• Bythebay | Apr 24, 2012, 11:03 AM EDT

  Brendan Kearns, Northern Ireland is a legal separate ocuntry from Ireland. Queen Elizabeth II acknowledged no such things, you're misinformed. She has every right to go to Northern Ireland which is legally part of the United Kingdom. She came to Ireland and was warmly treated and invited back again. Sinn Fein need to grow up, they should not run for offices they refuse to carry out. They should resign from Westminister in London where they're being paid and doing nothing. Their terrorism accomplished nothing. Leave Ireland and Northern Ireland alone. Both countries are very happy as is.

• STEVENSTAR | Apr 24, 2012, 10:08 AM EDT

  @@@@@@@@@@BRENDAN KEARNS | Apr 24, 2012, 07:22 AM EDT>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SPOT THE AMERICAN... THEY JUST GO ON AND ON AND ON AND ON.... WELL AS AN IRISH MAN LIVING HERE IN IRELAND ID WISH YOU PEOPLE WOULD KEEP OUT OF IRISH AFFAIRS AND WHAT GOES ON IN MY COUNTRY IN THE YEAR 2012 IS NOT ANY OF YOUR BUSINESS .... NO MATTER WHERE YOUR GREAT GREAT GREAT GRANNIES UNCLES CAME FROM A HUMDRED YEARS AGO ... NOT YOUR BUSINESS ..

• bogsidebunny | Apr 24, 2012, 07:07 AM EDT

  This is the Irish equivelant of a 3 year old's holding their breath and turning blue....Infantile culture!

• IrelandNorth | Apr 24, 2012, 06:36 AM EDT

  There's a whale of a difference between republicanism and loyalism. One is a paradigm democracy, the other retrograde autocracy. The essential distinction between meeting a president as a citizen and a monarch as a subject is the acuteness of the angle to which one is require to bend. Perhaps Lord Mayor O Donaghaile (Oh Donn-eela) suffers from an old sports innjury he doesn't want to provoke. England's relationship with Germany is probably helped by it not occupying six counties of upper Saxony. But we should 'grown up' and 'move on'. After all 2012, (apart from being the Mayan apocalypse), is also the centenary of Titanic's sinking and Carson's Ulster Covenant subverting Irish democracy - still extant! The Mayor of Cashel died of cancer, and was not assassinated as shamelessly inferred. As a Dubliner, I do respect Her Majesty's maturity in bowing in respect to the IRISHMEN AND IRISHWOMEN of 1916, and her standing to attention to the Irish national anthem - Amhrann na b'Fhiann (Our-aun na Vian)/The Soldier's Song. She's quantum leaps ahead of many of her own subjects, even if her respective jusridictions are not democratically mandated. What if she's returning the title deeds of the 6 counties? New York is a city. Northern Ireland is a six county neo-provincial statlet. Geographical correlations between which are as dubious as between Al Quaeda and the IRA.

• Scotchtommy | Apr 24, 2012, 01:36 AM EDT

  The man is right to stand up for his principles and we must respect his views .Although it could have been the funniest meeting of the year as Elizabeth desperately tries to pronounce his name."So nice to meet you Mr Dangargoyle/Dungargle/Doingaily"In other words-everybody lighten up.Although Liz is lucky not to have to look at a face like that close up.

• AMWilson | Apr 23, 2012, 10:21 PM EDT

  Allan07, if you're a descendant of Muslims and you feel that your kinfolk are being oppressed, then go for it. Otherwise, the situations are hardly analogous. Irish-Americans funded the provos due to family connections in the North, not simply to spite the Brits. You act as though the Brits and the Loyalist community did NOTHING wrong. Do you seriously think NI was a fair society, and that the Provos just came out of nowhere and disrupted what had previously been a perfectly happy and peaceful society? Come on, at least be fair and honest in your assessments. Neither side has had much to be proud of.

• ArmaghCity | Apr 23, 2012, 09:53 PM EDT

  @allan07 ... Nor do I live there. I live in Andytown. Now, if you want to have a MATURE debate, instead of resorting to anti-Yank bigotry at every turn, let me know. But resorting to childish name-calling, I.e., "clueless monkeys", it completely discredits you and I won't sink to that low level of a playing field. Other than your bigoted rants, you seem intelligent enough. Prove me right on that.

• ArmaghCity | Apr 23, 2012, 08:30 PM EDT

  @allan07 ... I am not an American. Now, what were you saying about "clueless monkey"?

• TayandCake | Apr 23, 2012, 07:50 PM EDT

  FallRNat prayer mat, negotiations?? careful now, haven't we learned not to make generalizations

• seanomelb | Apr 23, 2012, 07:21 PM EDT

  Hats off to the mayor he stepped down and handed his position to a unionist.The mayor supported the funding for the event thus proving his outreach to all the community.He resigned on a matter of principal and should be applauded for doing so. I noticed the usual mealy mouthed anti nationalist mob below could not respect him for his principled stand. They muddy the waters and go off the topic by evoking Al Qaida. They have the attention span of a goldfish.

• FallsRNat | Apr 23, 2012, 06:46 PM EDT

  when the bombs went off in London on July 7, loyalists attacked mosques & muslim communities, it's hard to see them having any sympathies with al qaeda. Al Qaeda is known in english as the base, it is simply a vehicle for all islamic terrorist organisations to commit atrocities under 1 banner, the sum of the parts was always greater than the whole, if you think that al qaeda doesn't exist then youse are sadly deluded, they make PIRA & UVF look like the boys brigade, there will be no negotiations with them until you're on the prayer mat.

• FallsRNat | Apr 23, 2012, 06:38 PM EDT

  I thought that Sinn Fein prided itself on being representative of all of the people on the island of ireland, aah, a true shinner never changes his spots, whenever, they have the chance to rise above the bigotry, they show themselves as just as much as the people they choose to decry, so i guess we know all along who will be living in their UI, not many & certainly no prods.

• sirpeter | Apr 23, 2012, 06:22 PM EDT

  allan07:The truth is there is no Islamic army or terrorist group called Al Qaida.And any informed Intelligence officer knows this.But there is propaganda campaign to make the public believe in the presents of an identified entity…The Country behind this propaganda is the US (Robin Cook former British Foreign Secretary)

• TayandCake | Apr 23, 2012, 05:02 PM EDT

  jezlouise allan calm yourself down, all that rage not good for the soul. Time for you to get some much needed therapy I think. Get yourself to The Ring O Kerry, very relaxing spot or then again you must think after Warrenpoint you fall off the edge of the world.

• allan07 | Apr 23, 2012, 04:29 PM EDT

  @bythebay I could see a point in the future if the Americans continued their silly games in supporting the SF/IRA band wagon some protestants may well express a desire to throw money towards al-queda. Why not? Its all fair in my opinion. Its even more bizarre when you analyse it. Americans financially supporting terrorism (IRA) who then bought their arms from the Mad Dog in the Middle East. Colonel Gaddafi. Of course the US and Gaddafi detested each other. One providing the funding and the Colonel providing the arms and making money from it all. So if al-queda need some money yes then why not. (Providing they willn't be doing any damage in Northern Ireland.) Lots of protestants would support an eye for a eye. For 40 years many lives here in Northern Ireland have been terminated due to the stupid Americans and their support of terrorism.

• allan07 | Apr 23, 2012, 04:00 PM EDT

  @bythebay perhaps the protestants should support al-queda as the americans have been financially backing the IRA for years. How would the Americians feel about that? Shall i get the tin out and start collecting?

• allan07 | Apr 23, 2012, 03:58 PM EDT

  @bythebay I cannot say that they are but many protestants have expressed the opinions that I have outlined. Whats the difference between a protestant giving money to al-queda to kill americans in New York when Americans have been giving money to the IRA to kill protestants in Northern Ireland? Is there any difference? I cannot see any at all. Can you see any difference? Are the IRA defined by Americans as being good terrorists whilst al-queda are bad terrorists? I assume al-queda may be defined as being bad because they are killing mainly Americans if they were killing protestants in Northern Ireland when the Amercians would probably define them as being good. Of course the americans have a history of supporting terrorism when it suits them. What about Oliver North giving the Contra rebels in Central America arms and financial backing. Then in Chile they supported General Pinochet to overthrow the elected government as they did not like the choice made by the chilean people in free and fair elections. Hardly honest people.

• Bythebay | Apr 23, 2012, 03:47 PM EDT

  allan07, Queen Elizabeth II was warmly welcomed to Ireland and stayed 4 days. She was greeted by members of Government and had numerous parties and gatherings in her honor. The Union Jack flew over Government buildings, the reception for her at Dublin Castle and elsewhere where she was. All that of course was ignored by Irish America. They need to mind their own business and leave us alone.

• Bythebay | Apr 23, 2012, 03:41 PM EDT

  allan07, are protestants supporting al-queda? I've had to explain so much to the Irish American clueless monkies I didn't bother explaining about Queen Elizabeth's title. They wouldn't cop onto it anyway. They're mired in muck and apparently won't get out of it.

• Bythebay | Apr 23, 2012, 03:36 PM EDT

  ballyhip, ridiculous. If you're still discussing that you have a time warp. Get over it. Move into the 21st century with Ireland.

• allan07 | Apr 23, 2012, 02:52 PM EDT

  @bythebay do you think it right that the protestant people should now support al-queda? Its a strange question but with the American governments having supported terrorist in the form of the IRA then its no different is it? Amercians giving funds to the IRA to kill people in Northern Ireland. So if the targets of the amercian backed terrorists now supported al-queda well it the same in reverse. Of course we could dress it up as a charity (similar to Nor-aid) and call it say Afghan-aid or Iraq-aid. It all seems logical to me. Lets face it there are lots of victims of American brutality, rape, torture and orphans during the past 10 years. Shall we start a collection for the victims of american aggression and genocide? What happens to the money once given to Afgan-aid is of course nothing to do with us. If they decide to have a few 9/11's then it will have nothing to do with us. (Of course Canary Wharf had nothing to with the US or so they say). Its all fair to me.

• allan07 | Apr 23, 2012, 02:35 PM EDT

  @ArmaghCity who gave you the right to promote terrorism such as the IRA and their thugs. It time to accept that its not your concern to get your US nose out of the affairs of the rest of the world. After Afghanistan and Iraq I think you would learn. Then theres Viet-Nam and the carpet bombing of innocent people including women and children. Even if your from Ireland you dont live here so zip it. Michael Collins accepted it so dont you worry about it. Its no wonder al-queda exist when amercians attempt to enforce their beliefs onto others. @bythebay wise words again. The only problem I have with the stupid fool who wrote this story is their lack of knowledge on the matter. Queen Elizabeth 2 is not the Queen of England. Queen Elizabeth 2 is the Queen of Great Britain AND NORTHERN IRELAND, Head of the Commonwealth, Head of the Church of England. Why cant the writer PATRICK COUNIHAN get his facts right? Hes probably a plastic paddy in any case. Typical American rubbish from a yank. One minute their fighting terrorism the next they are giving money to the IRA. Clueless monkeys!

• allan07 | Apr 23, 2012, 02:21 PM EDT

  The good Lord Mayor, bless his small heart and small brain, exhibits that same depressing malady that I have regularly commented on in these pages, a sadly genetic predisposition toward childishness, i.e. a chronic inability to grow up and become an adult. Bythebay, you are on point.

• greensod | Apr 23, 2012, 02:19 PM EDT

  Not a good example for the youth on how to get along.

• peterson | Apr 23, 2012, 02:07 PM EDT

  He is very rude!! (polite for stupid)

• Springfield9 | Apr 23, 2012, 01:39 PM EDT

  I'd think it would be better to simply shake her hand and smile ........ then show her your back.

• ballyhip | Apr 23, 2012, 12:52 PM EDT

  The fact that we are still discussing The Easter Uprising and the December 1921 Treaty tells me that it is not a moot point. Their are just too many families here and in Ireland whose lives were touched by the Treaty to say that it settled the partition of Ireland for all time despite the Good Friday Agreement. Simple demographics tells us that Unionism is strong in only two counties in the North. If a boundary commission was ever reconstructed, I wonder what the boundary lines would look like?

• hyattsville | Apr 23, 2012, 12:33 PM EDT

  Sounds quite immature. This is the type of behavior one would expect from an adolescent, not an elected official. Who pays his medical coverage and pension by the way and the security that protects him? Sinn Fein? Hardly! He sounds really dim, better off without that 'leadership'.

• johnr | Apr 23, 2012, 12:07 PM EDT

  question: do you think this is his personal decision, or could he have been instructed by sinn fein leadership to step down early?

• citizen69 | Apr 23, 2012, 11:55 AM EDT

  It all seems fair enough really. A Republican politician doesn't want to meet the Queen and a Unionist one does so the resulting situation of the SF mayor stepping down a few days early is good for both sides.

• ArmaghCity | Apr 23, 2012, 11:55 AM EDT

  @LacarourSeanB ... an eloquent post. I have nothing wrong with the Queen's visit just as I have nothing wrong with the Mayor's choice of not celebrating her, and I agree that we should not hold onto grudges (Maggie Thatcher being a personal exception, sorry). But your reference to 1916 as "now moot" is unfortunately so true of the free-staters mindset these days, and that is such a great disappointment.

• LacarourSeanB | Apr 23, 2012, 11:34 AM EDT

  Does seem that he's seeking a largely cogent middle ground, although truthfully I don't know anything about the man. I must say that I was positively impressed by the Queen's quite magnanimous remarks when she spoke at Dublin Castle last year. The poor woman seems deeply interested in doing the decent thing and didn't have to go to Ireland at all. Her acknowledgement of a difficult and unjust history is praiseworthy. She just as easily could have kept quiet...Now if she'd only rescind Henry the VIII's ill fated decision. We recently had a reminder of a Man's Rising on this past Easter. We really should focus on that and it's broad ramifications and as such move beyond the now moot sentiments of a 1916 Rising. Of course, such things are never really moot as History is an important barometer as to what has happened and what we can no longer allow. However, a historical perspective needs to be just that and should NEVER be an excuse for needless acrimony or keeping wounds deliberately painful. We need none of that. The Queen is a good woman in a substantively thankless job. She should be made welcome in Ireland. I understand the current Belfast Lord Mayor's point and I do think that he's seeking a sound compromise so as to keep all satisfied. Yet I don't fully agree with him. Imagine the value in terms of Human Capital and Christian decency were a Sinn Fein Mayor to graciously welcome a Queen who has gone to great length to ameliorate the present by accurately acknowledging history and as such is clearly seeking to move past that history in a proper and just manner. Might this not be the better move?

• Sparklet | Apr 23, 2012, 11:26 AM EDT

  Whether you agree with him or not, at least he's being true to his principles.

• Bythebay | Apr 23, 2012, 11:16 AM EDT

  The rest of them should resign from the British Parliament in London, they're collecting money and doing nothing, as usual. Outrageous gall they have.

• Bythebay | Apr 23, 2012, 11:09 AM EDT

  ArmaghCity in the US, don't label people when you know nothing about them. Come with Ireland to the present to live which is the reality today. Forget your bombs and bullets which accomplished nothing. Collins gave up Northern Ireland, 30 years of US supported terrorism didn't change that. Ireland and Northern Ireland are both very happy as we are and want to live in peace, so let us do so. You have enough problems in the US to focus on.

• Bythebay | Apr 23, 2012, 11:06 AM EDT

  ArmaghCity in Irish America, there's no such thing as Irish Unity, give it up. Ireland gave up all rights to the separate country of Northern Ireland as part of the Good Friday Agreement. Collins had no such problem giving up Northern Ireland. Live with it. It's over. Leave Ireland and Northern Ireland alone.

• ArmaghCity | Apr 23, 2012, 11:02 AM EDT

  ByTheBay ... I highly doubt that Connolly, Pearse, Clarke, McDermott, etc., would think of Irish-America's general opinion on Irish Unity as an "embarrassment" to Ireland. Quite the contrary. They probably think of them as being more Irish than you.

• ArmaghCity | Apr 23, 2012, 10:51 AM EDT

  ByTheBay ... BrendanDunphy is right. You free-staters have turned your collective backs on your fellow countrymen from the North. And after all the sacrifices that have been made by so many in our history, shame on you! To Irish-America, thank you.

• RedBranch | Apr 23, 2012, 10:15 AM EDT

  This looks like a healthy choice for Mayor O Donnghaile. Last year the mayor of Cashel chose to meet the Queen against SF party policy, the man is now dead.

• Bythebay | Apr 23, 2012, 10:12 AM EDT

  BrendanDunphy, time for Irish America to grow up and move to 2012. The Germans and English aren't still arguing WWI or WWII and refusing to meet each other. Your and your ilk in the US, most long removed from Ireland, are an embarrassment to Ireland and Ireland's wish to live in the present.

• BrendanDunphy | Apr 23, 2012, 10:05 AM EDT

  @Bythebay ... this is his choice and he is entitled to it. He is not saying "don't celebrate it", he is simply choosing not to do so himself. Good for him. Your comment, and presumably others that will soon follow, is precisely why the heroes of 1916 (and 1981 for that matter) are turning in their graves at what has become of today's Irish.

• Bernadett | Apr 23, 2012, 09:56 AM EDT

  This is why I would NOT vote for this party

• Murph46 | Apr 23, 2012, 09:46 AM EDT

  Hey it's his choice!

• STEVENSTAR | Apr 23, 2012, 09:39 AM EDT

  IDIOT !!!

• Bythebay | Apr 23, 2012, 09:24 AM EDT

  Good Riddance! If he's not willing to fulfill the role he was elected to do he should not be in it. Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom and this is their Queen. If he doesn't like it he should emigrate to the US.