Real IRA men appear in Dublin court under Offences Against The State Act

Seamus, can you confirm that Frank Lagan or his deputy offered condolences to the families on the evening Jan. 30 1972?

Dano. You answered a differant question from the one I asked. Do you think the verdict would have been the same had Noye not have had the comfort of a jury and a bias judge instead.

Seamus...the jury were persuaded that he acted in self-defence...that's a defence in common law...

Dano, Why wouldn`t Noye have beaten the rap ?

They say 'ignorance of the law is no excuse'...but in Seano's case I guess we can make an exception...just look at the case where one Kenny Noye beat the rap after killing a cop...

Dano giving his para mates a leave pass with his selective vision of justice The paras fired on innocent civilians, you're a thick as a brick Dano.

Any more takers on the challenge of supplying all the cases of intimidation that some believe brought about the need for diplock courts ( otherwise known as a more respectable face for Internment of those in society who made noise when they were supposed to remain quiet).

Stupid me. He hasn`t got that power anymore after taking early retirement and a nice pension. Oh the perks of being a super.

How about it Redbranch. The poor Mc Brearty family would have ended up in prison for the murder of Ritchie Barnes and poor Frank short would still be in prison long after he got out had that detectives wife not felt so scorned and spilled the beans on all the coruption from the bottom right up to the super. Who by all accounts has the power to put people away of his belief.

Dano. A bit late for the fancy footwork. You have exposed yourself as having the welfare of para`s suspected of murdering inocent Nationalists over Irishmen who can expect no where near the same calibre of justice. AS for the headline being. As for nothing being assumed in a trial. We can only assume the honesty of the super who will have these three men put away on a membership charge.

Trial by jury is the mark of a civilized society. It is not perfect, but aspires to the qualities represented by the figure of justice atop of the Bailey and adopted in courts across the western world. Jury tampering is not only wrong I would argue its moral debasement as well. As the PIRA recognized no elected government on this island and since it apparently practised non-jury trials itself; I don't believe it would have any qualms over interfering with the existing legal system and hence the response of Diplock. Judges in these had to tred very carefully indeed.

Seamus – I’m really not trying to be smart over this…the issue here is the different ‘burdens of proof’ required in civil and criminal law…The enquiry found that the victims had been unlawfully killed…which means there was no justifiable reason for them to be killed. Now the suspects in the case are certain members of the Paras who were present on that day…to obtain a conviction, the prosecution has to prove, beyond a reasonable doubt, that certain members of that platoon had intended to kill, and had fired rounds that in fact did kill; Nothing can be assumed in a trial, all relevant facts must be proven. If the defence convinced the court that the men believed they were under attack, (and so acting in self defence) even if that belief was mistaken, then they would have to be acquitted…That’s what the common law states…this is where you can have the anomaly of a finding of unlawful killing, and an acquittal… On the issue of names…the names of any defendants would certainly be given, it’s only witnesses who ever have names withheld…as to the headline, I don’t see that as a big deal…IC articles are frequently badly titled and written…

Dano, Yet again you atempt to change reality with the word game. Ok we`ll have it your way, lets charge those individual para`s (who i have mentioned collectively to date)with unlawfull killing, But that won`t diminish the pain for the victims families ( including Mc Cabes) who all believe their loved ones were murdered. We in Derry could live with manslaughter verdicts against individual soldiers if it ever came to it. More importantly is the truth as to who ordered the UNLAWFULL killings of so many Nationalists who after all were only seeking basic civil rights. Lets not forget either the same regiment were let loose in Ballymurphy with the same result. Why did Frank Lagan (head of the RUC in Derry at the time) send word to John Hume ,not to attend the march. Back to the issue at hand, I would be in total favour of all information being divulged in court. even including the soldiers names. As for you finally admitting the injustice of the articles headline. Such a pity it had to be dragged from you screaming and kicking like the truth on so many other subjects on this site.

Redbranch. If my uncle had breasts he`d be my auntie has as much to do with this issue as your input. What orders I would have followed or not have nothing to do with it considering i`m not one of the three charged. Jury tampering is a world wide activity in normal circumstances never mind in political ones. Show me the justification for diplock courts. More so ones where all the evidence remains secret. What do you think about the Mc Brearty or Short families treatment in Donegal ?. As for Gerry Mc Cabe, you should be asking that question to the courts yourself. I didn`t sentence Mc Cauley and the others, I certainly didn`t release them either.

Seamus - So how do you square 'Innocent until proven guilty' with your comments on the Paras? A decision that people are unlawfully killed (made under civil law provisions) is completely separate from a criminal trial for murder...as Redbranch quotes re Det Garda McCabe...and you really can't be serious in wanting guilt for murder decided on the word of a 'Super'? Such a verdict would be immediately be appealed...as for the headline that bothers you...yes they should have said 'alleged', unless these men have confirmed their membership of said organisation...maybe they have?