Real IRA men appear in Dublin court under Offences Against The State Act

Seano - Yeah, right...so you're withdrawing that 'He's not faced trial' post, eh??????

Dano you claimed Noye beat the rap indicating the Spanish judicial system was somehow remiss all I did was state the reasons why Noye "beat the Rap' as you put it. His imprisonment is entirely a different issue.

Seamus – the ‘Gardiner Report’ DID NOT state that it had found no evidence of Jury intimidation…It clearly stated that ‘in the interests of security and of the protection of witnesses… we will NOT PUBLISH the evidence we received’…this has been MISREPORTED as ‘No evidence was found’…The report RECOMMENDED that ‘Trials of scheduled offences should be conducted by courts without juries’ so one can only conclude that this must have been supported by the ‘unpublished’ evidence…as you have made that report a major plank of your argument…you may wish to reconsider?

Dano. You just have a serious problem accepting facts on the ground as they happened.Where in the world have so many people signed confessions of their own velision, knowing the outcome. Simple fact is, most people regardless of their background would not have sat comfortable presenting verdicts on confessions alone. The criminal underworld Noye belongs to have been caught out on many occassions jury tampering yet he was afforded a Jury. The Gardiner report found NO cases of Jury tampering from Nationalists. Whether I agree or dissagree with you on the matter of Republican justice. Would agreeing make the states abuse of many international laws as they did OK. Punish inocent people for the activities of others. The Nazis done that when ever the french resistance served out their justice. Though I can only imagine there would have been some less severe punishments should the french resistance and others had prisons.

Seano - You said 'he has not faced trial therefore innocent until proven guilty'...in fact he is serving LIFE for a 1996 murder...so much for your 'facts'!!!

My last post stated the facts in the Noye's case and addressed your anti Irish stance.

Seamus – you make some very good points…Who could believe that ‘republican’ freedom fighters would ever try to ‘influence’ the members of a jury…be they neighbours, co-religionists, fellow-workers?…No Sir!! Anyway, the ‘republican’ version of justice, that’s the no trial, no appeal, summary execution and burial at night on some beach version, was obviously a much fairer way to go…no need for any Barristers, lazy or otherwise...

We almost got distracted from the diplock issue by means of the word game. Any way there is a clear timeline for anyone who wish`s to look at it. We had Internment (the one that 30,000 people protested against on Bloody Sunday) The same internment that was making the brits look bad on the international scene. What could replace it ? How about diplock courts where the judge would require nothing more than a signed confession to convict ( regardless of how the same confession was retracted). Would a jury blend with this moraly in the knowledge of all the torture and ill treatment of prisoners taking place around them. Probaly not. Enter the intimidation theory that the Gardiner report said did not exist but let diplock stand unopposed. The judges who Redbranch says had to tred carefully then set about wholesale imprisonment of Nationalists on mere confessions. As the beatings fazed out to a lesser level forensics took over.Relatively new to them the sometimes lazy and or overwhelmed defence barristers simply advised defendants to plead guilty for the 15 years or not guilty to the 30 years. Not as difficult to make a choice when you know from all those who have gone before and gambled with the british loaded dice.

Dano. you can`t resist playing the words game. He proved enough that the jury took his word as to the threat he felt under when disturbing 2 masked men in a heavily treed area of his garden in the dark of night. The problem is, what you keep saying is the law is not always deployed as it reads in word. Marian price is testiment to that.Not to mention all that have been legally abused before her.

Seano - I may be 'thick as a brick' as you so eloquently put it...so given your last post...what does that make you, cobber???

Seamus – You ask what would a legally trained judge have made of Noyes defence? Impossible to say without hearing the evidence, and how credible the witnesses were…

Noye didn’t ‘prove’ anything in relation to his stabbing a cop to death…it doesn’t work like that…the prosecution have to make the case for conviction…the defendant doesn’t have to 'prove' his case under common law...murder is a common law offence in both Ireland and England...

seano. Think you`re mixing up Noyes proven lawfull killing and the one he is now aledged of.

Dano cares not about jury trials and can only take place when it suits him. Kenneth Noye just did not "beat the rap" as Dano stated he has not faced trial therefore innocent until proven guilty. But Dano is selective on his judicial opinion as to whom is granted a trial by jury and whom he believes is innocent or guilty. Noye was released by the Spanish under the principal of reciprocity and a weak case put forward by the British.Is rights as innocent until proven guilty are questioned by Dano.

Redbranch. To be honest I don`t know.