Priest says Vatican control of Irish Catholic Church is crushing

Eiriamach! "Tóg go bog é", you say. Moi? Shure I'm enjoying the crack ("crack", as one of your supermunificence will know, is the correct spelling - "craic" is a modern bastardisation of "crack", just to make it look more "irish". Originally, "having the crack" meant - long long before the days of radio - a group of Irish sitting around farting and having a great laugh at the various forms of that particular skill on display. Great gas altogether! I think it's paerhaps your good self who needs to take it easy. I suppose you mean no harm. I'm sorry you backed out on the 1,000 word challenge. It only serves to prove my point. By the way, if you still don't know how to put a fada on an Irish vowel, please ask (it's no harm to show doubt or ignorance about a particular feature - really!) and I will lay it out clearly for you. Now, to use a bit of Latin instead of Irish for a parting remark: Derdago forte lores inaro demant lores demar trux fuler bulsen cowsan dux. Slán abhaile agus go neirí an bothar leat. Éamonn, Dublin, Ireland.

Just one more thing, EamonnDublin, in case I inadvertently wrote an insult in my Gaeilge bhriste: I translated your slur about my head being "a silo-full of manure" into Irish, and it read like a nice compliment! "Leasu" (past part. adj. leasaithe) ~~"amendment, improvement, reform, redress, etc." As for my showing a grasp of moral relativism, I did that in my previous comments, again-- as any open-minded reader can see. Tog go bog e. (Pardon lack of accents.)

EamonnDublin, why would you wish to have a discussion with someone you consider a "presumptuous, conceited, twit"? A productive discussion requires at least a somewhat open mind. You accuse me of self-contradiction: Spell it out; unpack that accusation; be specific about just ONE of the "many instances." I do not back down from a sincere challenge, but I deal in specifics when I debate, and I eschew invective. So I cannot say as how I'd enjoy discussing relativism with you, but if you have a specific objection to something specific I wrote, let's see it. As for me, I am quite content to let the exchange stand just as it is for anyone who cares to read through it and make up his or her own mind about whose words are on point. This is not the place for an academic lecture in meta-ethics, so 'no thanks' on your invitation to make "a 1,000-word opening statement."

Ah come on, Eiriamach! Don't back out now! Now is your chance to show that you have a bit of a grasp of moral relativism. Éamonn, Dublin, Ireland.

KatieMurphy: Hitler is DEAD. D.E.A.D. As for your name for Pope Benedict, all I can say is "SAD". Éamonn, Dublin, Ireland.

RATAinger in 2009 UNexcommunicated a holocaust denier. Need I say more.................Yes, it appears that hitler has yet to be explicitly excommunicated by the church that claims to protect life.

"Eiriamach". You really are such a presumptuous, conceited, twit. If you wish to have a serious discussion about the varieties of relativism, come on, let's have you. You go first and we'll see what you're made of. From your earlier ramblings about moral relativism, self-contradictory and confused in many instances, it is very obvious that you have an extremely limited, very basic grasp of the beginnings of the subject for such a discussion. I look forward to, at least, a 1,000 word opening statement from you. Éamonn, Dublin, Ireland.

I see that EamonnDublin has done some research into the varieties of relativism. Go Maith! Ní saor go binn, nó go binn leasaithe b' fhéidir.

"Eiriamach", I think it's time to wrap this one up. Your interpretation of relativism - moral, descriptive, meta-ethical, and/or normative relativism - is apparently unique to you and narrow to the point of oblivion. I do not wish to offend, but, sincerely and seriously, I really do think you should go and see a psychiatrist in order to rid your suffering head of a silo-full of manure. Thank you, GeorgeDillon for putting it more politely than I have done. Éamonn, Dublin, Ireland.

Let's not forget that Joseph Ratzinger's Nazi affiliation was not all in his early teen years. He spent two years in the German army as well. As Austin Cline writes, "None of the other Germans who joined the Hitler Youth, were part of the military in Nazi Germany, lived near a concentration camp, and watched Jews being rounded up for death camps has ever become pope." So again I ask why that choice for pope? Why not be more careful? Cline asserts, "Ratzinger believes that greater fidelity to Catholic doctrine, as defined by the Vatican, is necessary to counter movements like Nazism." But movements like Nazism are recognized by their techniques of control and centralizing power. Censorship is foremost on the list of strategies. What are we witnessing now?

eiriamach: What a whining bore you are. Keep your stupid moralizing for Bible School.

The Vatican is getting very friendly withe Germany and the EU. Beware !!

My point has nothing to do with relativism, Eamonn. Apparently you still neither understand moral relativism nor recognize it in your own thinking. I introduced an analogy with other 14-year-old boys to show that youth is not an excuse for homicide. By analogy, the Pope does not have a prima facie excuse for joining a Nazi organization simply because he was young or because the law required it or because "everyone was doing it" or any other reason RELATIVE to time, place, or circumstance. There is a transcendent moral law for him, as for 14-year-olds everywhere and for us all. If we disregard it, it does not disappear. Right and wrong are not relative to time, place, culture, youth or age (to the extent one is competent), nationality, prevailing politics, social or family pressures, or other such circumstances. Coercion provides an excuse only when nothing of great moral importance is at stake. If you hold a gun to my head and demand all the money in the cash register, I may give it to you and remain innocent of theft, but if you pass a law requiring that I be complicit in genocide-- or even in censorship-- then I may not obey it and remain innocent.

"Eiriamach", What on earth does "14 year old boys in the USA carrying guns into schools and killing their fellow pupils" have to do with Pope Benedict joining Hitler youth at the age of 14? I thought you detested relativism? Éamonn, Dublin, Ireland.

EamonnDublin, in the USA, we have had 14-year-olds carry guns into schools and kill their fellow students and teachers. Shall we say "Boys will be boys" and overlook their perverse character development? The young Joseph Ratzinger went directly from Hitler Youth to a Catholic school and on through seminary. If I disregard his Nazi training, I am still compelled to ask about those who elected him Pope, "Could you find NO ONE ELSE qualified for the job?" It was a mistake, an embarrassing one, especially now that Benedict XVI's focus on centralizing all decisions and power in the Curia has become unmistakably clear. If his writings had redeemed his past, I might be kinder in my judgment, but while he occasionally gets something right, as in his 1967 statement on 'conscience,' explicating PPaul VI, his theology is at best so-so, his explications of scripture jejeune, and his direction of Vatican policy autocratic. The point that Bythebay made about his Nazi affiliation is relevant to explaining his current policies. Briseann an dúchas trí shúile an chait.