53 Comments

• eiriamach | Dec 05, 2012, 06:24 PM EST

  Just dropped by today, and I'm sorry I missed Barneyjo's and seanomelb's comments of last week. I ap0ologize to barneyjo, who is right, certainly, that not all Catholics are censoring bullies. I'd like to see discussion and debate between Catholics and other Christians, particularly the doctrinal/liturgy centered churches. Like in the old days, I mean early church councils, where people talked and debated until they reached an understanding that almost everyone could agree on. If you read the Catholic idea of "infallibility," it suggests that we know the truth has emerged when all Christians reach consensus on matters that transcend eras and cultures. And seanomelb's point, yes, I know that some defrocked priests and others are assigned to media tasks such as posting on Catholic Church news articles and blogs. In some cases, the task is assigned almost by extortion in exchange for not prosecuting abuse cases against the priests. IC has a share of them; some use female screen names, and some use multiple names and give themselves away with the same repeated mis-spellings and grammar idiosyncrasies. I'd guess that background explains much of the didactic and mean-spirited tone. But it's so counter-productive for the Church!!!

• barneyjo | Nov 30, 2012, 03:28 AM EST

  @Mortimer74 - I think we have come to the same place but from slightly different directions. The points you make regarding the prevalence of abuse in society are of course reasonable. I would differ from you in my view that the history of child abuse within all the christian churches which of course must include our own catholic church is of an entirely different magnitude. From the point of time scales (incidents of child abuse by religious predators has been known about for centuries in the case of our own church for nearly 12 millennia. Secondly, from the point of dogma - a critical factor ( that members of all churches have on the one hand sought to entreat us to live by the word of God, yet in many instances have been shown to have feet of clay and they themselves have not lived by that word). From the point of restitution ( that all churches have rowed back to some degree on the committments made to child protection) Of course, as a practicing catholic, my main concern must be for my own church. So when I see hear what has been done to cover up such horror, and the lies and deceit used, not by some, but by many, regrettably I neither enthuse about, or endorse the "broad brushstrokes" you paint of our church in action in relation to how it deals with priest abusers, or more importantly, their unfortunate victims.

• olovely | Nov 30, 2012, 01:03 AM EST

  Put all those child rapes behind you, the Church has. Just get back in your knees to them like your grandparents did. The history in between never happened.

• Mortimer74 | Nov 29, 2012, 11:16 PM EST

  barneyjo (part2). I do believe the Church has set in place appropriate measures to safeguard children. I can’t speak for Ireland but in the US for example the Church: -has trained over 6 million children in providing them skills to protect them from abuse (through specially designed programs created by prominent child safety experts) -has trained over 2 million adults, including over 99 percent of all priests, in recognizing signs of abuse -has conducted over 2 million background checks, including those in the intensified screening process for aspiring seminarians and priests -has installed review boards in nearly all dioceses, with the purpose of the boards being to thoroughly review all credible allegations of abuse -has installed “Victim Assistance Coordinators” in every diocese Of course the implementation of this infrastructure depends on human beings who are not infallible. We can never ensure that every policeman is a straight one, every politician an honest one, but we must ensure we have systems in place to identify and deal with them expeditiously.

• Mortimer74 | Nov 29, 2012, 11:11 PM EST

  Barneyjo, (part 1), I promised to get back to you so here goes. Given the procedures put in place from the time of the Dallas Charter in 2002, it is indeed hugely disappointing when there is serious mismanagement and manipulation by even one bishop. Archbishop Diarmuid Martin of Dublin was as vociferous as anybody in his condemnation of Magee, and highlighted the damage done to the credibility of the Church in Ireland at a time when it was striving to institutionalize accountability. I recall government ministers calling for 5 year prison sentences for bishops deliberately covering up cases of child abuse. I would go along with that – provided the same rule is applied to anybody anywhere who covers up cases of child abuse. Victims of abuse deserve for there to be a level playing field in this regard. I shudder to think how many administrators in the US public school system would find themselves behind bars if such a measure were implemented, to give just one non-clerical example.

• TayandCake | Nov 29, 2012, 09:04 PM EST

  You're barking up the wrong tree there Mr Brown

• Mortimer74 | Nov 29, 2012, 06:43 PM EST

  Commentator, part2: The three companies that insure the majority of Protestant churches in America say they typically receive upward of 260 reports each year of young people under 18 being sexually abused by clergy, church staff, volunteers or congregation members. What percentage of all priests in the US were convicted between 1950-2002? 0.2%. How many credible allegations against Catholic priests were there last year? 7. Yes, 7. Sure, there have been bad priests who betrayed the Church. One of the Apostles was a traitor. The other 11 were wonderful men. The record of the Church compares favorably to society at large. Again, get it into your brain: perspective. As to your other points, yes, the Church did indeed pay compensation to fraudulent “victims.” Those that genuinely suffered deserved compensation, an apology and sympathy. As for those who, aided and abetted by unscrupulous lawyers and “victims groups,” made false accusations against innocent priests (and there have been many – 173 over the last 3 years in the US), they are the real “filth.” Now that the dust has settled, in every case where a priest has been exonerated, the Church should sue the fraudsters and extortionists, and take back the monies paid to these lice. Lie detector test? If you do a little research, you’ll find that many accused priests over the last decade have willingly submitted to lie detector tests and passed them. Their accusers, meanwhile, have mysteriously shied away from them. Unfortunately, the results have not been allowed in the kangaroo courts.

• Mortimer74 | Nov 29, 2012, 06:42 PM EST

  Commentator, part1: good grief! Where to start with you? I’ll start by agreeing with one point. Objective, impartial media coverage of the abuse issue has indeed helped bring about reforms in the Catholic Church. Unfortunately, there has been little objective, impartial coverage. Rather, mainstream media has obsessively narrowed its reporting on the Catholic Church. Thus, the brainwashed and deluded like you and others on this sight, completely miss the point. You write, “Why would you ask about abuse in other denominations and schools? How does that impact the Catholic Church clergy?” Try to get one word into your brain. Perspective. Child sexual abuse is a societal problem. Let me repeat and rephrase that for you: child sexual abuse is a society-wide problem. You speak of a “world wide epidemic”? Yet, you, like the other embittered, myopic people on here deliberately restrict the perception of that epidemic to the Catholic Church. Ignoring the plight of children who have been sexually abused by ministers, teachers, sports coaches, scout leaders, stepfathers, uncles and so on is a disgrace. According to government numbers, in 2010 alone, there were some 63,527 reported cases of child sexual abuse in the United States. 9.2% of child abuse cases are sexual. Why would I mention schools? Are you for real? A 2004 report commissioned by the US Department of Education found that “nearly 9.6 percent of [public school] students are targets of educator sexual misconduct sometime during their school career.” The author of the report, Hofstra University’s Charol Shakeshaft, has said, “Think the Catholic Church has a problem? The physical sexual abuse of students in schools is likely more than 100 times the abuse by priests.”

• seanomelb | Nov 29, 2012, 06:37 PM EST

  Eirimach!! The woundedknees Mortimers and Jacers of this world when they lose an argument they resort to bullying and bigotry. They are not capable of reason. As a catholic born Presbetyrian church (married) and now a committed atheist(humanist)i love all people of all religions or no religion. I think you will find that Jacer is a priest or a failed priest.

• barneyjo | Nov 29, 2012, 06:33 PM EST

  @Mortimer74 - I have had the same problem. Persistence pays they do say :)!!

• Mortimer74 | Nov 29, 2012, 06:20 PM EST

  barneyjo, I'm trying hard to get posts up. Have submitted numerous times. Alas, only post 2 of 2 to eiriamach was published. My response to Commentator has not appeared (sent hours ago). Not sure why IC is not publishing them. Will happily reply to you once they have done so.

• barneyjo | Nov 29, 2012, 06:15 PM EST

  @eiriamach - be assured that not every catholic is in the business of censoring dissenting or alternative view; myself being an example. After all, to dissent and disagree is to follow in the footsteps of Christ who during his ministry went out of his way to challenge the prevailing "status quo" of his day, and paid for it with his life. I also hope that you will appreciate that many of us, as Catholics are relative newcomers to the concept of dissent, and it will take us a little time to play "catch-up" :)

• eiriamach | Nov 29, 2012, 06:04 PM EST

  How ironic it is for Catholics like WKnee to be calling someone of my religious persuasion "fundamentalist"! It is not at all strange, however, for Catholics to be trying to censor me again, yet again, and then again some more, more....

• barneyjo | Nov 29, 2012, 05:10 PM EST

  @Mortimer74 - grateful for any further views and reflections you might care to share re my observations on Bishop John Magee in Cloyne, Ireland, or Bishop Finn in Missouri. My point being that the "whole" is not necessarily as great as the sum of the parts!!

• olovely | Nov 29, 2012, 05:09 PM EST

  Reflect on the tens of thousands of raped, abused, and forgotten children and the culture of shame and secrecy that made it flourish. And rejoice when the last Roman outpost sends them packing back to Rome.

• Mortimer74 | Nov 29, 2012, 01:56 PM EST

  eiriamach, part2: Although SNAP’s name contains the word "priest", with contemporaneous cases of Catholic clergy abuse all but drying up (how many more times can they and their disreputable contingency lawyer friends dig up the same old cases from the 1960s?), these charlatans are increasingly having to find business elsewhere - "rabbis, bishops, and Protestant ministers and increasingly, victims who were assaulted in a wide range of institutional settings like summer camps, athletic programs, Boy Scouts, etc." they say. How touching.

• Mortimer74 | Nov 29, 2012, 01:50 PM EST

  Excellent observation, WoundedKnee.

• WoundedKnee | Nov 29, 2012, 01:45 PM EST

  eiriamach is a Protestant fundamentalist. She has every right to believe what she wants, but she should butt out of discussions about the Catholic Church. We Catholics don't stick our noses into the affairs of the Bush Baptists!

• casualMBA | Nov 29, 2012, 01:42 PM EST

  The Papal Nuncio's example of the faith of Ireland's ancestors in "times of persecution, famine and even forced emigration," asking the Irish people to reflect on its' value, would not be possible, were it not for actions related a former Papal Nuncio. A survey of Irish history shows Catholicism would have been severely diminished in Ireland, if not eradicated, without the defense of this (English) Papal Nuncio. The recent appointment of P.N. Brown indicates, aside from genuine merit, the Magesterium is also aware of its Irish history, Elizabethan in addition to recent, assets as well as liabilities.

• barneyjo | Nov 29, 2012, 01:36 PM EST

  @Eiriamach - thank you for the steer. I will follow through and comment further if anything gels with me. I must say I had thought you were resident in Ireland, though I now assume that is not the case :)

• eiriamach | Nov 29, 2012, 12:35 PM EST

  Barneyjo, if you visit this page again, I'm curious about whether the "Tablet" writer Robert C. Mickens' speech at the Cleveland Club on 11.16.12 had an impact in Ireland. He spoke of the ongoing "implosion" at the Vatican. It's available on You Tube and various blogs in case you're interested. (He made remarks similar to some comments you've written on IC.)

• eiriamach | Nov 29, 2012, 12:23 PM EST

  Your optimism is a blessing, barneyjo! "If patience is worth anything, it must endure to the end of time. And a living faith will last in the midst of the blackest storm."-- Mahatma Gandhi

• barneyjo | Nov 29, 2012, 07:19 AM EST

  @eiriamach - never hopeless. The truth has a habit of revealing itself, even to doubters and apologists........eventually!!!!

• eiriamach | Nov 29, 2012, 06:32 AM EST

  It seems quite hopeless to attempt any discussion with people like Mortimer, who writes about an "anti-Catholic cabal (neo-atheistic media, SNAP." They have their conspiracy theories and imaginary enemies lined up to blame, and they will not admit to the fault being in their own institution. SNAP has done untold good for victims of sex abuse. SNAP has also fought the diabolical secrecy of the Vatican and bishops by keeping the media focused on the problem. And what the heck is a "neo-atheist"? These RC Defenders are very, very far from being able to deal with reality.

• barneyjo | Nov 29, 2012, 06:17 AM EST

  @Mortimer74 - Respectfully, I have to disagree. What the church says it has done, and what has actually been done has not been borne out in all instances. Take here in Ireland for example. Bishop John Magee of Cloyne (Cork) Diocese; a former personal secretary to three Popes had to resign after it had been shown that Dr Magee had deliberately misled and falsified reports on what had actually been done to ensure compliance with guidelines which had been introduced by the Conference of Irish Bishops in the first place. He is shown to have lied to the Church's own watchdog in falsified reports, whilst sending verbatim reports to the CDF in Rome. It is only this week that a new Bishop has been appointed to Cloyne Diocese; a former parish priest from the neighbouring diocese of Kilaloo. So, even after guidelines have been introduced, here in Ireland, in the United States, in Australia, senior members of the hierarchy have been found to have wilfuly flouted their own guidelines when it suited them. Now this suggests to me that there is not yet complete and true remorse for the abject failures of the past and present. And until there is, I believe God will continue to hold a mirror up to the church, as if to say "you need to do more" before true renewal is possible.

• markday | Nov 29, 2012, 12:59 AM EST

  Dear Arcbishop Charlie Brown, The horse is out of the barn and the emplero has notand the emperor has no clothes. You talk of the anguish you experience over the sexual abuse crisis. The Irish people have gone beyond anguish to disgust, because the pope and the cardinals have never taken true responsibility for the clerical crimes. This, more than "secularism" is the reason for the religious decline. Charlie, face it, you have zero credibility. Better just to remain silent and try to preach by your example, if you can.

• The Commentator | Nov 29, 2012, 12:53 AM EST

  Part 2 Mortimer74 Why would you ask about abuse in other denominations and schools? How does that impact the Catholic Church clergy? Does that now make it alright because others are doing the same? I'm tired of hearing excuses. The true colors of the church were revealed in the extent of the cover up and inaction by the church hierarchy to address the abuse during the past 50 or so years and before that. You mention that the church has paid out billions and even have the audacity to write “(erroneously in many cases)”. What a lame comment. Just imagine how many thousands of raped children that are dead through suicide, drug abuse, or mental illness caused by the clergy that did not or will not receive any compensation. The victims who have received compensation are just the tip of an iceberg so don't demean the victims who were abused and cast doubt about the authenticity of their abuse. There are many more victims who are afraid to expose themselves to the publicity and have their families and friends know about the molestation that was inflicted upon them. As I mentioned in another comment, there are still clergy in 2012 stating publicly that the children brought it on themselves by tempting the clergy. One can extrapolate from that public comment that there are many others in the church who hold similar views. The responsibility for this widespread molestation squarely rests with the Vatican because they are the entity that appoints and/or approves the church hierarchy from priest to pope, but while I have seen dioceses sell off property to pay claims to victims, I have yet to read anything about the Vatican dipping into their billions of dollars to compensate the victims. Just saying !!!

• The Commentator | Nov 29, 2012, 12:51 AM EST

  Part 1 Mortimer74 The Catholic Church has been forced to take action because of the publicity. As long as there was a semblance of hope that the abuse could be hidden away and brushed off as isolated incidents, the Catholic Church hierarchy cajoled victims and their families to remain silent and assured them action was being taken, but of course the only action being taken was to transfer the rapist molester to another parish. It is now clear that the molestation was not, and is not a local phenomenon, it is a world wide epidemic and a conspiracy of silence throughout the Roman Catholic Church hierarchy. The only way I would feel confident that the church is really being sincere and honest is for all the church hierarchy from priests to pope take lie detector tests with pertinent questions about their actions and knowledge of the raping of children by church officials. Once that was done with the result being made public and all offenders being removed from the church and be required to register as sex offenders throughout the world, then one could say that the church is being proactive. Until then, this is all damage control to prevent further erosion of the money making machine.

• seanomelb | Nov 29, 2012, 12:09 AM EST

  Mortimer I am not anti any religion I choose to be an atheist and I expect you to respect that right as I respect your right to be "religious". It is you who's the bigoted one moron. Jacer Jesus the man is what would be called a "social liberal" in this century. His teachings were hijacked by Paul and others to further their own agenda. If you both wish to muddle your thoughts with unsubstantiated fairytales be my guest.Maybe you both are incapapble of independant thought. You both sound like a couple of brainwashed priests.

• Mortimer74 | Nov 28, 2012, 09:29 PM EST

  @barneyjo, sorry but I have to disagree. That the church has too often failed to address past problems of abusive clergy has been frankly admitted by everyone from Popes John Paul II and Benedict to the U.S. bishops in 2002. No other organization has done as much to put in place measures to protect children from abuse as the Catholic Church has in the last 10 years. The Church and its institutions are today safer than almost any other institution where adults are in contact with children. Pope Benedict himself has called the abuse that took place "filth." And the Church has paid out billions (erroneously in many cases) in compensation to victims. That neo-atheist, secular media outlets choose not to report this, but instead pursue a witch-hunt and smear campaign (falsely reporting that Cardinal Ratzinger blocked sanctions against a Milwaukee priest who abused deaf children in his care for example) is not the Church's fault. Have you any idea of the abuse that goes on in other denominations and schools?

• jacersagain | Nov 28, 2012, 09:14 PM EST

  (…more) and leave the indifferentism of videos, internet, Gaga or Justin Bieber and mobile/cell phones alone for enough time to reflect on what they’re all leading them from... from the fact that they are all going to die someday and where they might find videos, internet gambling and pronography, Mario Lanza or Madonna and ET’s phone home to call back to earth in their next life. To paraphrase Charles Schulz’s peanuts wise Charlie Brown character: “… (Our Faith is) a historical gem to this country… Ignoring it is dangerous”. Or how about: “We’re here because we love him. We here because we hurt and that’s OK” or “God, we trust you to take care of Erin”. I don't think that A/B Charles Brown’s comments are short of Charlie Brown’s wisdom.

• jacersagain | Nov 28, 2012, 09:11 PM EST

  Our Christ was the first person to fight for real justice in his land of birth, challenging the ‘status quo’ of his time. That caused a revolution that has lasted 2000 yrs so far, with sign of it ending (despite what church-bashers allege). In these times of ours, there is a ‘status quo’ that Nuncio A/B Brown is challenging us all on. He’s right to do so… and he’s right about the numbness and even ignorance perpetrated by music, tv, internet, video games and texting habits of people of today. He’s right too, to quote Maximilian Kolbe saying that he “diagnosed the spiritual disease of our times as indifferentism . . . that it really doesn’t matter too much what a person believes”. I think it’s very important that people ask themselves what they believe in today to avoid diseases such as Kolbe spoke of and… (More...)

• Smyrnian | Nov 28, 2012, 08:53 PM EST

  WoundedKnee - Well said indeed and a priest gave the speech at the Kilmichael commemoration? Times sure are changing! I remember the day when that would never have happened!

• barneyjo | Nov 28, 2012, 08:06 PM EST

  @Mortimer74 - "Meanwhile, the Church has put its house in order, and continues to do its good work - in Ireland" - No not yet, but I have enough faith and belief that it will do so, eventually; but not before the institutional church has shown true and sincere remorse for the untold damage and ruination it has wrought, and which has resulted in so many broken lives, broken bodies, broken minds, and worst of all, broken souls!!

• mairint | Nov 28, 2012, 06:36 PM EST

  It has become dreadfully apparent over the past 20 to 30 years that a viscious and hostile trend has grown in the Irish 'modernists'. Along with their expressed ignorance of history and fact they chatter like the 'Hollywood Set' and are about as empty of truth and reality. They do not appear to be able to distinguish between the Church as founded by Jesus Christ (which I follow) and the the members of the clergy who have sinned and failed to live the Christian way so therefore they just throw the 'baby out with the bathwater'. It seems to be fashionable for many Irish to grab onto the 'hate the church' garbage and so they can forget there is right and wrong, good and evil, and go their merry way oblivious to the thousands of charitable works done by real members of the Church. These people do not go about blowing their own trumpets but they are in every city and town supporting people in need, our brothers and sisters in Christ.

• Mortimer74 | Nov 28, 2012, 06:22 PM EST

  misneac, you're absolutely right. But I fear your message will be wasted on most of the pathetic bigots below. seanomelb, for example, doesn't realize the irony of his comment, bless his addled brain. The anti-Catholic cabal (neo-atheistic media, SNAP, and the likes of the losers below) are desperate to make a decades-old issue seem topical. Meanwhile, the Church has put its house in order, and continues to do its good work - in Ireland and around the world. Love the faith, live the faith!

• aloistmartin | Nov 28, 2012, 06:03 PM EST

  Six Pint`s Of Porter and a Basket of Fried Fish and Potatoes the Real, Charlie Brown !

• ColleenRua | Nov 28, 2012, 05:38 PM EST

  The Papal Nuncio talks like a politician

• seanomelb | Nov 28, 2012, 05:36 PM EST

  Misneac ignores"recent historical facts"

• misneac | Nov 28, 2012, 05:28 PM EST

  Most of the comments posted are totally hostile to the Catholic C Church and have no basis in historical fact .The work of the Church goes on ,and despite the wishful thinking of bigots it continues to do amazing work to feed and help those in need .Thousands of free meals are fed free of charge to needy people each day in Dublin by Catholic institutions ,and no questions are asked !I wouldnt bother seeking to answer some of the stupid and insulting comments ,suffice to say that none of you will live to see the Catholic Church dissappear from Ireland !

• kevinsinnott | Nov 28, 2012, 04:59 PM EST

  It's likely true that many of the Irish have forgotten their faith, but that's true worldwide. A number of the comments here sound like someone who's met a bad bank teller or two and then withdrawn all their money. Ultimately faith has little to do with how one views their religion's clergy. I've met many good and faithful priests and nuns, but I've met some who disappointed me. So what! In the scheme of things that does not matter. To address one specific comment, women were arguably treated like chattel before Christianity, better afterwards. People in general have never been treated ideally, religion or not. Catholics especially revere a woman's role. In fact Catholics and other Christians have lately taken to protecting women's lives even before they are born.

• seanomelb | Nov 28, 2012, 04:37 PM EST

  It was the total committment of the Irish to their faith that caused them to accept every turn of phrase by their Bishops. WE now know we were lied to and treated like peons by the church. The papal Nuncio can take his woprds back to Rome and tell the Chief priest the Irish are finished and do not trust their bulls##t anymore

• WoundedKnee | Nov 28, 2012, 04:23 PM EST

  I just realized that today in the Anniversary of the Kilmichael Ambush, that cold November Sunday when a small and poorly equipped detachment of patriots from West Cork made a stand against the foreign presence in Ireland and demonstrated that British military and special forces could no longer terrorize, torture and murder with impunity. I was interested to read that a priest gave the speech at the commemoration last Sunday. Maybe a new and democratic Church is indeed being born in Ireland.

• WoundedKnee | Nov 28, 2012, 03:52 PM EST

  culchiewoman: "it was the Church itself responsible for much of the misery of those times." So the Church was responsible for the Penal laws? For the persecutions instituted by England in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries? For the ethnic cleansing of Catholics? You're a complete nut, culchiewoman. Grow up and learn a little history. By all means remain a bigot, but at least be a smart one.

• SCVMalcolm | Nov 28, 2012, 03:05 PM EST

  IF the Irish DID reflect on our ancestors' deep Catholic faith, we'd revolt or leave the Church. The faith and the people hasn't changed; the Church has. As a youth, the Church had NOTHING in common at at all with the fundamentalizt Christian Churches or the Mormons. Now the only difference between them is their religious rituals!

• PhoenixZouave | Nov 28, 2012, 12:55 PM EST

  Well now ain't it simply amazing? After the Catholic church secretly sold out tthe irish Republican movement in the 19th century, the contemporary Irishmen should reflect on the faith of its fathers when the Vatican sold out the Republicans to the English? God bless Reggie Dunne and Joseph O'Sullivan!

• Gearoid4 | Nov 28, 2012, 12:49 PM EST

  While acknowledging the damage done by the abuse scandals, the quality of the comments below suggests that religious and historical ignorance is the contemporary currency, concerning the contribution to and the devotion of Irish people to the Catholic Faith in centuries past and present.

• Gearoid4 | Nov 28, 2012, 12:48 PM EST

  While acknowledging the damage done by the abuse scandals, the quality of the comments below suggests that religious and historical ignorance is the contemporary currency, concerning the contribution to and the devotion of Irish people to the Catholic in centuries past and present.

• Murph46 | Nov 28, 2012, 12:24 PM EST

  A ludicrous assertion,because slavery was practiced for years should we revere it and go back to it?

• pilib04 | Nov 28, 2012, 12:02 PM EST

  Yeah, I wonder how many of my ancesters were raped by these "clerics."

• jim treacy | Nov 28, 2012, 11:17 AM EST

  THE STRENGTH OF THE OLDEN IRISH FAITH WAS BASED ON KEEPING THE SHEEP IN THE DARK. TODAY WITH 24 HOUR NEWS AND THE INTERNET THE CATHOLIC CHURCH IS DEAD IN THE WATER. WHEN PUSH COME TO SHOVE THE NEW PHILOSOPHY OF THE CHURCH IS " IT'S ALL ABOUT THE MONEY " WHICH HAS DRIED UP OF LATE

• The Commentator | Nov 28, 2012, 11:16 AM EST

  I believe the Roman catholic Church hierarchy is still paying lip service in their hollow apologies. Actions by the Church have demonstrated their true feelings. So sad it happened and now everybody knows so we have to say something since we got caught lying. The real trajedy of the raping of children by priests is that in many, many occurrences around the world is that non offending priests who had knowledge of the abuse did nothing and when other church hierarchy were made aware, they suppressed the knowledge and reassigned priests to new territory so they could do it again. When the abuse became common knowledge the Church still dismissed the allegations and did not offer help for the victims, instead they made financial moves to prevent the victims from receiving monetary compensation. Even today there is denial of the responsibility by the Church. This is a 2012 comment. "A prominent Catholic priest says he believes “youngsters” are often to blame for sexual abuse by priests and that priests who are first time offenders should not be jailed for their crime." He probably believes the Holocaust was the fault of the Jewish people." People that make comments like the above should be made to wear a large sign for the rest of his life that reads. "The children raped by priests asked for it." Another option is for him to spend a day in the desert with each of the victims and families of the victims. I don't think he would survive many days in the desert.

• culchiewoman | Nov 28, 2012, 09:17 AM EST

  Ah yes, let's hark back to the good old days, when women were treated as chattel, had their children taken from them and remanded to industrial schools and residential institutions (to be abused and raped), or trafficked out for adoption, and were themselves thrown in Magdalene Laundries for their crimes. Il Nuncio refers to this great faith as being sustaining in "times of persecution, famine and even forced emigration," yet it was the Church itself responsible for much of the misery of those times. And the generational impact of that misery will be felt for years to come. Closing with a quote indicating some sort of empathy for survivors of that regime while failing to acknowledge, apologise and make reparations (especially in the case of Magdalene survivors and victims of forced adoption policies) for what those survivors suffered, and even obliquely suggesting we return to this mythical 'time of faith,' is a slap in the face.