A Loyalist band member deliberately urinated in a Catholic church grounds during the massive Orange parade at the weekend in Belfast. The march was held to commemorate the signing of the Ulster Covenant in 1912 to keep Northern Ireland part of Britain.
Monday’s Irish News newspaper carried a picture of the man, with drumsticks urinating in the grounds of St Matthew’s Parish church in a small Catholic area which stirred angry responses.
The Orange Order Grand Chaplain Reverend Mervyn Gibson has visited St Matthew’s Church to apologise and said the incident ‘was outrageous and unacceptable’.
Speaking on BBC Radio Reverend Gibson ‘apologised unreservedly to the priest and parishioners of St Matthew’s’ and said the Orange Order ‘will be looking at this seriously’.
Sinn Féin Councillor Niall Ó Donnghaile welcomed the apology from the chaplain and Orange Order Grand Secretary Drew Nelson.
“Too many times in the past when sectarian behaviour has been caught on camera the Orange apologises but do nothing to prevent further breaches in the future. The Orange Lodges book these bands and put them on parade,” said the former Lord Mayor of Belfast.
“The Parades Commission also need to reflect on the behaviour of the bands outside St Matthews in future when they make determinations,” added the councillor.
“I hope that the Orange Order will now acknowledge that the nationalist experience of these parades has been anything but positive. The sort of sectarian and offensive behaviour we witnessed on Saturday is the norm when parades pass St Matthews.”
“The Orange Order has spoken much about respect in the course of the past few weeks. There was very little respect for the residents of the Short Strand on display on Saturday.
The Parades Commission had placed restrictions on what music bands could play while passing St Matthew’s Church in east Belfast. Police have said any breaches of the law will be fully investigated.
Sinn Féin MEP Martina Anderson called on the Orange Order to apologise for the presence of Fascist MEP Nick Griffin of the British National Party.
DUP councillor and Orangeman, Christopher Stalford said the “values the BNP represent are the antithesis of unionist values”.
However, Traditional Unionist Voice MLA Jim Allister said that the Orange Order ‘did Ulster proud on Saturday’.
“The fantastic turnout for the Centenary parade was not only a great feat of organisation, but a marvellous tribute to our Covenant forefathers and timely reminder of the strength of Unionism when it stands determined to resist that which is destructive of our British citizenship”.
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Switch to the desktop site to post a comment.IrelandNorth | Oct 05, 2012, 08:40 AM EDT
Census of Ireland, 1911 reported the population of Ulster province as 1,581,696 (ie approximately 949,017 Protestants and 632,679 Roman Catholics respectively), in contrast to that of the Island of Ireland as a whole. (An Chartlánn Naisiúnta/National Archives, 2012). Carson's Covenant got 471,000 public signatories, ie only 49.6% of Ulster Protestants and 29.7% of Ulster's total population (with probably zero RCs signing). If Carson's Covenant had been a plebicite on Ulster maintaining the union with Great Britain/or imposing partition on Ireland, it would have been defeated by a ratio of 2:1 within the province. Which is perhaps why he resorted to threats of paramilitarism and gerrymandering, a poor substitute for consensus and constitutionality, thereby setting a precedent for reactionary violence of like kind. O'Brien, Bill and J Keegan, (Ed) (2012). "The Alternative Ulster Covenant: A Tribute to the Role of Progressive Protestantism in Irish History" reports that 12,000 Co Antrim Protestants signed FOR Home Rule and against Carson and partition in 1913, the year Carson's UVF was established. The rest is hysteria!
celtboi | Oct 04, 2012, 09:11 PM EDT
oo zzzzzzzz
seamus60 | Oct 04, 2012, 08:56 PM EDT
Lets get real here folks. If the OO don`t give a monkeys about thousands of parades plodding all over the place every year, many that offend, they are hardly going to revert into "lets all talk" mode over something that is as mild as this dribbly drawers.
seanomelb | Oct 04, 2012, 07:38 PM EDT
Poor old Kilsally trying to justify British yobbo behaviour.
seamus60 | Oct 04, 2012, 12:23 PM EDT
The OO have only apoligised for the bandsman who couldn`t hold his water, because he got caught on camera.Nothing new in these lout bandsmen pissing in public.Nothing new either in that they never get charged with the same offence, even though in full view of ruc officers on many occassions. Must be an axcepted cultural thing. Where ever you may be , let your orange urine run free.
DaithiSuibhne | Oct 04, 2012, 12:00 PM EDT
Of course this is acceptable in his community.
warrenpoint00 | Oct 04, 2012, 11:54 AM EDT
A slight improvement here in the mentality of those Irish unionists of the six counties of Ireland that are loyal to the british crown.Couple of years ago those same people were dumping their piss on six and seven year old catholic school children on their way to Holy cross school.I wonder what the british queen would think of her loyal brethern,s antics.
Kilsally | Oct 04, 2012, 05:59 AM EDT
seanomelb and curtisjohnson - hmm seem to recall quite a few Australian headlines recently about drunken Irish yobs . Pretty certain if you go to any holiday spot the British & Irish are lumped together - the drunken yob culture is rampant in both
Kilsally | Oct 04, 2012, 05:57 AM EDT
ancavker - there is a difference between loyalty to being British and loyalty to the government of the day
seanomelb | Oct 04, 2012, 02:10 AM EDT
Was in Mirabela some years ago and the concierge was a little apprehensive until he realised we were not British. The hotel had every article of furniture bolted to the floor. A Canadian (with a sense of humour) who had a restaurateur with a sign stating "we speak Canadian" was vilified by some english football thugs demanding he should delete "Canadian"from his sign and insert "English"
curtisjohnson | Oct 03, 2012, 08:23 PM EDT
The incident is just typical of core british values - at least it wasn't as bad as Holy Cross where they terrorized school children. Re bogsidebritroll, no one compares to the english in terms of drunken, obnoxious and violent behavior - see the well documented holidays in spain (and any other area unfortunate enough to suffer their plague) football hooligans, etc. The Irish have a much better worldwide reputation.
ancavker | Oct 03, 2012, 02:38 PM EDT
kilsally: The signing of the Covenant was treason against the same British government you and your ancestors claimed to be loyal to.
oldboreen | Oct 03, 2012, 02:09 PM EDT
Er,so what's new? In "norn iland" this is par for the course. Is'nt this just another space filler-a slow news day?
RedBranch | Oct 03, 2012, 11:36 AM EDT
Very funny johnshiel, as they say about Gerry Adams he eats shoots and leaves!
hancock | Oct 03, 2012, 11:33 AM EDT
What a dick. Maybe he thought it was Brian Wilson's house.
johnshiel | Oct 03, 2012, 11:22 AM EDT
"...with drumsticks urinating..." Really?
Kilsally | Oct 03, 2012, 10:41 AM EDT
The problem is not the Orange Order - there were Loyalist women -pint / beer bottles in hand - beside the short strand (catholic short strand and loyalist newtownards road and right beside each other - westbourne presbyterian beside st matthews)booing loyalist silver band for playing hymns
Kilsally | Oct 03, 2012, 10:38 AM EDT
Disgusting behaviour but not so sure it was intentional - I was on parade on Saturday and saw several bandsmen who had obviously been in the pub having to leave mid parade to go behind a hedge or wall. As to IrelandNorth`s statistics - the signing of the covenant happened all over the place and can`t really be compared to a parade or rally - 30,000 doesnt include the huge crowds watching either. Membership of most voluntary organisations are well down no matter what they are - churches, scouts, orange order, boys brigade, political parties
6countybrit | Oct 03, 2012, 09:49 AM EDT
There is a big contradiction between your headline and the story. Headline says Orangeman - Report says Bandsman...Two different things. More deliberate pro IRA/Terrorist/Republican propaganda by this tripe! Bad journalism with an agenda...that's Irish,(IRA),News central all over! Why not just call yourselves..Anti British/Protestant/Orangenews.Com Next you'll have free bomb making advice for young Irish Americans to attack anyone that cares to disagree with them! Joke and a disgrace you lot! The actions of this "Bandsman" was wrong and the OO have apologised..get over it! The IRA have done allot worse..
ReturnedYank | Oct 03, 2012, 08:59 AM EDT
It's his culture. In the spirit of inclusiveness, we need to all celebrate it!
IrelandNorth | Oct 03, 2012, 07:34 AM EDT
Weekend poster on telephone kiosk in Henry Street, Dublin 01: "The Alternative Ulster Covenant. Public talk on the Ulster Covenant against partition signed by 12,000 Protestant from County Antrim in 1913. Wednesday, 03rd October, 2012 at 7pm (19.00hrs) GMT. Belvedere Hotel, Denmark Street, Dublin 01. Speakers: Reverend David Frazer and Bioll O'Brien. ALL WELCOME!"
IrelandNorth | Oct 03, 2012, 07:22 AM EDT
The population of the province of Ulster/northern Ireland was over 1,500,000 in 1912 (approx 1,000,000 Protestants and 500,000 Catholics) (Census of Ireland, 1911). Only 500,000 (ie 1/3 or 33%) of which signed Carson's Covenant. Therefore, 500,000 (c 50%) of Protestants and 500,000 (100%) Catholics didn't sign. Only 30,000 (3%) of Protestants (and zero Catholics) marched on Saturday to celebrate Carson's sedition and subvertion, a drop of 470,000 in over a century (4,700 p/a). At which rate no one will be marching in 6.8 years within our decade of centenaries. As good a time to consider Irish unity?
bogsidebunny | Oct 03, 2012, 07:22 AM EDT
I wish I had a € for every drunken Catholic sot that urinated on anthing and anyone. Most towns, village and certainly Irish cities are "no-go" zones from Friday night late till Sunday night. Heck, this dude on urinated. I've see the "soild waste" leavings on the Main Street in the nearby "Provincial Town" every Monday morning. Laneways are sewers of urine, feaces and vomit. It's a case of 4 year old minds in 12 and up year old bodies. Yes I said 12 year olds. They can access booze and drugs just as easy as 18's. And the sellers of booze don't care cause they know they will not be caught and in the very rare case they are they won't be prosecuted.
IrelandNorth | Oct 03, 2012, 06:54 AM EDT
Loyalists band members are not necessarily members of the Orange Order, though the Order have a certain responsibility for their behaviour of such bands. The Ulster Covenant was signed to keep all of Ireland in an involuntarily United Kingdom. Neither the neo-provincial statlet of Northern Ireland, nor its proto-republic doppleganger didn't yet exist in 1912, but were a consequence of Carson/Craig/Crawford Covenant.
Towngate | Oct 03, 2012, 04:14 AM EDT
The natural colour of urine is Orange but it can be easily altered to green by eating lots of peas! Buy shares now! ... But this is a lot of fuss over nothing. The piss will soon wash off with all the rain that constantly pelts down on Ireland, but not so easily the layers of excrement religion has placed over the country!
mairint | Oct 02, 2012, 11:54 PM EDT
In response to patsherrard - he would have had something amputated, his organ? his leg? his head? And the Orangemen wanted to parade in Dublin? Time they were banned altogether as they are only perpetuating Hatred and Bigotry.
mairint | Oct 02, 2012, 09:49 PM EDT
if they want british citizenship, they should go back to england. what do u think would happen to them if they did that at a muslim place of worship?
cillowen | Oct 02, 2012, 09:08 PM EDT
whadda you expect from those of the masonic orange order who fancy themselves as israelis.
seanomelb | Oct 02, 2012, 07:07 PM EDT
hardshoe your faith is honorable and just. Lowlifes straddle all beliefs.
teddybear | Oct 02, 2012, 06:15 PM EDT
When are people going to GROW UP.
irishamerica46 | Oct 02, 2012, 05:29 PM EDT
Disgusting behavior espesially near a Church! Disgusting behavior anywhere!!
aloistmartin | Oct 02, 2012, 03:43 PM EDT
The Philistine ! Nothing Christ said has any meaning for such a person. Why don't the Protestant`s emasculate themselves of Christianity altogether ? I. though I. saw a Swastika and a copy of the Daily Mail in an Alley down the Street, they could all get on their Sunday Bests, hands and knees, and start to Worshiping Of !
hardshoe83 | Oct 02, 2012, 03:30 PM EDT
To all the Catholics here, please don't thik all of us protestants are like this. I'm of presbyterian faith and I find this unacceptable. This is the behavior of a lowlife and a loser. How anyone could support an organization like the orange order is beyond me.
borefield | Oct 02, 2012, 01:07 PM EDT
Ignorance is a terrible thing. Those that are born with it have a tough time getting beyond it, they may graduate to "stupid" , its all in the breeding. This animal is not worth talking about.
Smyrnian | Oct 02, 2012, 12:36 PM EDT
Darao - Surely you are not that naive??
JimmieM | Oct 02, 2012, 11:58 AM EDT
I don't think you could honestly expect any better of them
RedBranch | Oct 02, 2012, 11:38 AM EDT
To use the same strong word Gerry Adams used to describe the attacks on 9/11, this was 'wrong', but a timely, unreserved apology has been given by the OO. No harm to life, limb or property that a dose of rain wouldn't cure...
micky74007 | Oct 02, 2012, 11:33 AM EDT
can you expect much more from the orange boys? inbreeding creates morons.
Tooreenagrena | Oct 02, 2012, 11:24 AM EDT
Thanks darao for your Unionist spin on a dispicable sectarian act of hatred.
darao | Oct 02, 2012, 11:19 AM EDT
It looks more like he was in desperate need of a pee. He has his back turned and is discretely pissing in a corner. I wonder if it was more a need we have all had or if it was actually a deliberate intent to offend. Caution as to assumptions is warranted. Either way he should have found some other corner to piss in. I just think such things can be used to incite hatred when really there was no intent to offend and just a lapse in sensitivity. Peace - the ultimate goal requires letting go of minor indiscretions and refocusing on being kind and welcoming to other people.
benbhoy | Oct 02, 2012, 11:04 AM EDT
These people are the lowest of the low.unfortunately this is what happens when you are dragged upand without educatin.
CelticQueenUSA | Oct 02, 2012, 10:47 AM EDT
When that idiot dies may someone piss on his grave! Such infantile behavour is definitely deranged. Are we not all CHRISTIANS?
lecorri | Oct 02, 2012, 10:14 AM EDT
Only 25 times a year? Certainly in the past it was considerably more than that, tho perhaps now, it might be 'only' 25. All I can say is 'if only' that had been done years ago (keeping those eejits in their own area marching with people who give a rats arse), there would have been no 'troubles'. Alas, one cannot EVER count on the Brits to do the right thing where Ireland is concerned. Pity.
hermitTalker | Oct 02, 2012, 09:45 AM EDT
Rather than making rules for their marching past Catholic church buildings, requiring local residents to stand in defence 25 times a year, as a local leader said on Saturday how about the parades commission banning their hateful, sectarianism and confining them to their own segregated area. This photograph shows a contempt that they all hold in their hearts against CATHOLICS as fellow citizens and as a Church. Totally inexcusable and the media publicity feeds it.