Irish roots of Mormon founder Joseph Smith discovered

Mormons have always come to Ireland because we believe that the blood of ancient scattered Israel is rich in Ireland. God made promises to gather scattered Israel. The Fennians came from Phonecia in Northern Israel and worshipped the god Baal, hence they called places Baal this or that, Balina, Baille etc as was their tradition. Hibernia the ancient name for Ireland is possibly Heber Nua or the new land of the Hebrews who we are. We are Gaels and Ga El is Hebrew for the sons of god we have just forgotten who we are I could go on. So it is no surprise that Joseph smith who claims to be decended from Jospeh in Egypt should be Irish, the lineage of Irish Kings can be traced back to the ancient Kings oF Israel.

BTW, The LDS faith is growing and will continue to grow among Irish Americans more and more, and all of you need to get over it.

Whoo! What elucidate postings by 2B! Just goes to show that false prophet Joe Smith was doing about 120 yrs ago was the same as false prophet Mohammed did back about 1400 yrs ago. = Sayith Caiaphas to his fellow High Priests.

Paul warned constantly of the Apostasy that was coming in Acts and Thessalonians. But we also have the words of Hegesippus, as quoted by Eusebius: "...the church continued until then as a pure virgin and uncorrupt virgin: whilst if there were any at all attempted to pervert the sound doctrine of the saving gospel, they were yet skulking in dark retreats; but when the sacred choir of apostles became extinct, and the generation of those that had been privileged to hear their inspired wisdom had passed away, then also the combination of impious errors arose by fraud and delusions of false teachers. These also, as there were none of the apostles left, henceforth attempted, without shame to preach their false doctrine against the gospel of truth." And there's also Cyril of Jerusalem, who said, after quoting 2 Thess. 2:3-10: "...Thus wrote Paul, and now is the falling away. For men have fallen from the right faith; and some preach the identity of the Son with the Father, and others dare to say that Christ was brought into being out of nothing. And formerly the heretics were manifest openly; but now the church is filled with heretics in disguise. For men have fallen away from the truth, and have itching ears...most have departed from right words, and rather choose the evil, than desire the good. This, therefore, is the falling away.” I have more quotes if you want to hear it; but I think I have proven a disgusting Orangeman such as yourself how wrong and pathetic your criticism is, now you made yourself look like an even bigger idiot. So go back and cry to Ian Paisley while you're at it, and Lord Rebuke you.

2BorNot2B, We already do 'think outside the bun', LOL! In fact, True Christian Doctrine is very much on the outside and quite unorthodox. Those 'trinitarian' beliefs actually originated from the First Council of Nicaea, not the bible. And the scripture you cited talks about the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit; which are 3 separate beings. How about checking out Matthew 3:17, John 8:18, 14:28, 20:17 as well?

2BorNot2B, Aren't there also other lost books that were not included in the Bible, especially the other parts of the Apocrypha? What makes the bible complete and officially closed besides the decisions of men? Yet there are also many versions of the Catholic Bible as well, including the Douay-Rheims Bible and its Challoner revision, the New American Bible, the Jerusalem Bible, etc. And before that we also have the Septuagint. Don't be a hypocrite. Only Ron Hubbard wanted to create a new religion, the others only wanted to either reform Christianity or start a new church in the name of Christianity. Joseph Smith was the most correct of them all. So you also base the Truth on scientific fact and popular opinion? I can see somebody like you being among the pharisees in Jesus's day? Of course many popular theologians won't back up our claims; to do so would acknowledge that we're the real deal and would hurt their own faith. BTW, Quinn came out of the closet on his sexuality and became apostate, so he was excommunicated. How about the many Catholic writers and theologians that have lost their faith- like Charles Chiniquy, or Hugh Hewitt. God your arguments suck!

Whoo! What elucidate postings by 2B! Just goes to show that false prophet Joe Smith was doing about 120 yrs ago was the same as false prophet Mohammed did back about 1400 yrs ago. When Joe’s missionaries come to my door in Ireland, I chat w/ them as I would w/ any neighbour of mine of this world would. Then I give them a gift as they depart – Words of Christ (intangible) and Rosary beads (tangible). I find it a nice way for us all to meet and leave each other to go our ways, umbilically entwined in Christ.

Whoo! What elucidate postings by 2B! Just goes to show that false prophet Joe Smith was doing about 120 yrs ago was the same as false prophet Mohammed did back about 1400 yrs ago. When Joe’s missionaries come to my door in Ireland, I chat w/ them as I would w/ any neighbour of mine of this world would. Then I give them a gift as they depart – Words of Christ (intangible) and Rosary beads (tangible). I find it a nice way for us all to meet and leave each other to go our ways, umbilically entwined in Christ.

cont'd from below:--- Then there’s the writings of Ignatius Bishop of Antioch in 110 AD, Justin Martyr on 151 AD, Teophilus of Antioch, 181 AD, Irenaeus, who said : "For the Church, although dispersed throughout the whole world even to the ends of the earth, has received from the apostles and from their disciples the faith in one God, the Father Almighty . . . and in one Jesus Christ, the Son of God, who became flesh for our salvation; and in the Holy Spirit" (Against Heresies 1:10:1 [A.D. 189]). Tertullian in 216 AD, Origen, 225AD, Hyppolytus, 235 AD, Pope Dionysius, 262 AD, Gregory the Wonderworker, 265 AD, and during and after Constantine, Augustin of Hyppo, 408AD, Sechnall of Ireland, 444 to 452 AD and Fulgence of Ruspe, 515 to 523AD – And what to mo’s counter with? ‘THERE WAS A GENERAL APOSTASY!!! No, dates, no locales or personages mentioned, no historical writings or debates involved… just a vague claim, much as anyone would say. THERE WERE UNICORNS ROMPING ABOUT DURING JOE SMITH’S TIME! Who's to say there weren't if Joe saw them.

Again OquirrBoy proposes: ** Funny how many Christians and Christian sects before AD 325 did not hold Trinitarian beliefs** -- There’s a TV commercial you should take to hear Mr O: “Think outside the bun!” Obviously, if you read nothing more than mo ‘historical accounts’ you’ll never arrive at actually learning what was really happening in the world from the time of the death of the last apostle to your date-line for the much vaunted-and very little substantiated- mo dateline for the ‘great apostasy’ which supposedly came with Constantine. – Trinitarian beliefs are encapsulated in Matthew 28:19, where Jesus instructs the apostles: "Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them IN THE NAME (not NAMES, which would imply ‘gods’) of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit." Further, it appears elsewhere in in the New Testament (e.g., 2 Cor. 13:14, Heb. 9:14), as it does throughout the early Church writings like the Didache "After the foregoing instructions, baptize in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, in living [running] water. . . . If you have neither, pour water three times on the head, in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit" (Didache 7:1 [A.D. 70]). This date is scarcely 4 to 6 years after Peter and Paul’s death. -- continues..

OquirrBoy sez in defense of his sect not holding the bible as the ONLY book God- inspired, and to absolve the use his sect makes of EXTRA-biblical writing of definite human origin: **(the bible is..) A book that comes in different versions and has been mis-translated and misinterpreted from time to time.**--- Yours is a very POOR argument based on nothing more than mormon sophistry in order to deflect and excuse the writings mo's use. -- The bible was UNIFORM for some 1500 years, until the so-called ’protestant reform,’ at which time Luther decided to extract seven books he deemed inconvenient to his own theories regarding salvation.-- After that even the King James bible - which mo's co-opted for the sheer convenience of calling themselves ‘Christian,’ contained all 73 books; again’ until protestantism in the form of Anglicanism was imposed by Henry, Liz, Cranmer, Cromwell et al -for the purpose of robbing the Church of its monasteries and property, and the English people of their Catholic faith. -- Once the prot wave was initiated and lack of theological authority ensued there was no stopping creation of multifarious claims, theories, and yes.. bible versions to suit the convenience of every charlatan who deemed himself 'illuminated' and wished to create a new 'religion' (as Joe Smith, the JW's Russell, the SDA's and even Ron Hubbard in our day have done). -- Bottom line, your claim is totally unsubstantiated by verifiable facts, and that ANY reputable theological seminary not associated with the contortions and manipulations mo apologists at BYU engage in to give credence to LDS 'theorology' prove. -- In fact even some people who were considered to be the 'brain trust' of the mo sect like Michael Quinn and the Toscanos, have been excommunicated for ceasing to claim there is any truth or reason in mo theories.

Catholics in one state have never spent over $70 million dollars influencing the politics of another state. The Catholic Church openly admits who it campaigns against and who it bankrolls. That is not the case with the Mormon Church. = Yet the Catholics in California wanted our help on Prop 8, and so we helped them. And the 70 million wasn't officially spent by the Church, only by its members, don't forget. And Catholics have been equally as active in American politics in the past; I remember in the late 30's, when the Spanish Civil War was raging- the American Catholics forced Congress to not recognize, or give aid to the then Spanish government because they were Communist & were persecuting Catholics in their country. And so they were successful in forcing the US government to sit on their hands while Franco won the war and defeated the government.

OQuirkester: Our Jesus in Heaven does not have wives or children, does yours? = No he doesn't. People who have died as Catholics or Protestants can't be "converted" in Heaven. = They can in the Spirit World, however. Which is why we do Baptisms on their behalf in our Temples. Catholic and Protestant church sanctuaries are open to anyone to come into to pray, light a candle. I've never heard a priest or a pastor - ever - say that Mormons were Christians. = I highly doubt they would say that anyways. Most Priests and Pastors are against us because we pose a threat to converting their flock and eventually putting them out of a job. However one Pastor in particular has said that he and many others have 'sinned against us'. And our Churches are also open to anyone too. We sure don't acknowledge Joseph Smith in any way, shape, or form. = So? That's because to acknowledge him will admit that he was right all along. And I know bigots like you will never do that. So you believe in EVERY word of the Creeds? = Nope; lot of the Christian beliefs that came after the Apostles were all killed and before Joseph Smith were perverted and had a lot of man-made doctrine mixed in. Did you answer that??? Do you believe in the Trinity? = As 3 seperate individual beings, we do. Well, at least I didn't call you "part of the Pharisees and Satanic inspired crowd..." =No, but its obvious you're part of that crowd, still.

Why not do some genetic testing on all Irish girls working as prostitutes on the streets of London ,Birmingham or Manchester in the U.K. After that do some genetic DNA testing on the children of mixed race crossings between Irish girls and blacks and Arabs or Orientals in both the U.K. and Ireland to see if they also have the genes of Niall of the Nine Hostages or Conn of the Hundred Battles. The descendants of Joseph Smith stateside might find out they have curious relatives these days in the Olde Sod

Well, Joseph Smith must have inherited the genetic gift of the Irish for spinning myths and stories unintimidated by facts and reason. ... Mormons have built a powerful way of life because of the religious practices that must be practiced in the home as well as in their paces of worship. Even their places of worship resemble a prosperous home, with comfortably "living rooms" for people to sit and think, pray, mediate. The sub-society they have built is really a marvel of organization and conformity. Even the music engenders conformity. It is amazing how a religion with some wild mythology and sexual glorifications is so conventional, well behaved and even priggish in daily life. On the whole they are OK, they build decent community, and are good citizens. ... Do nt be surprised if at some times the Mormons receive a revelation that much of their historic doctrines were in fact temporary metaphorical revelations concealing a truth that could not be fully revealed until now. The truth would be compatible with traditional Christianity. Mormonism allows for continual revelation by their current head Prophet.