68 Comments

• curtisjohnson | Aug 07, 2012, 11:11 PM EDT

  Yes. Shoot to kill . . . unarmed civilian non-combatants. British honour at its finest.

• sirpeter | Aug 07, 2012, 07:53 AM EDT

  Schon.You definitely have the weakest argument here.I like your explanation on the shoot to kill policy..On Bloody Sunday ye missed every IRA torso and shot kids.Or was that just practicing lol.

• curtisjohnson | Jul 28, 2012, 08:08 PM EDT

  I was not aware of that, seanomelb. Similar to the charade they went through over the bloody sunday massacre, I suspect it was used as a mechanism primarily to assert a hypocritical moral authority over the situation (after they were caught destroying inculpatory evidence) and absolve themselves. I wonder when they will apologize for the centuries of systematic torture and murder in Ireland, including countless instances of the barbaric the pitch and cap and half hangings (documented in their own records). You can bet you'll never see any reparations paid for any of their crimes, admitted or not.

• seanomelb | Jul 28, 2012, 06:17 PM EDT

  BTW Curtisjohnson last week (in a very low key way) the Brits apologised for torturing Kenyans in the 50's. Schon I live in Australia by choice and make periodic visits to my homeland the thirty two counties.I've also had many a chat with some of ex army mates who couldn't stand living in Britain after the British cruelty they witnessed in the six counties and they opted for a new start in Australia.

• curtisjohnson | Jul 28, 2012, 05:45 PM EDT

  Read the O'Loan report and the eyewitness accounts of the Ballymurphy incident to gain an understanding of the behaviour of the british state terror squads in the occupied statelet. Soldiers who were found GUILTY (a significant occurence given the typical show trial environment) of murdering non-combatants were not only retained in the military, but promoted. It's the same story all over the word - "soldiers" murdering, raping, and torturing non-combatants (see their treatment of the Mau Mau in Kenya for an excellent representation of british values in action).

• Schon | Jul 27, 2012, 11:42 PM EDT

  Seanomelb the running away from the Irish promised land to become a disillusioned outcast in Australia, emigrant. Why do you want the majority of people in the North to become citizens of a country that YOU ARE NOT PREPARED TO LIVE IN??? We don't want to live there either. And ever when the Irish Tiger roared, they didn't want us. They couldn't aford to pay the welfare bill then and certainly not now.

• Schon | Jul 27, 2012, 11:35 PM EDT

  seanomelb You with the memory of a amnesic goldfish. but I explained the shoot to kill policy... the point of aim was to be the torso of the target to ensure that the round was stopped by the intended target and did not continue on to hit an innocent third party. WRT the Civil Rights marchers being attacked... the organisers of the marches arranged for a large number of marches to occur at the same time throughout the province with the intention of over stretching the RUC (police). They were aware, from previous marches, that hooligans would attach themselves to the marches and attack the police. In addition the marches were through areas that had indicated that they did not want the marches to pass through. There was insuffiecient police, a force of 3000 to police all of Northern Ireland many of which had been injured in previous encounters with demonstrators. Your hypocraisy excells in praising the protesters against Orange Ordr parades and while castigating the protestants who objected to the Civil Rights march through where they lived.

• seanomelb | Jul 27, 2012, 07:21 PM EDT

  Bleeding heart schon conveniently forgets the shoot to kill policy and the civil rights marchers attacked and in some cases thrown of a bridge into the river by orange mobs whilst the B specials and the RUC looked on Let's not forget the protestants how also marched and were castigated ,intimidated and threatened with violence for taking part in the marches.Keep on making your miserable excuses justifying your attacks on the nationalists of the six counties.Retroactively rewriting facts is your forte.

• Schon | Jul 27, 2012, 08:26 AM EDT

  kinvara7 sorry I've lost the thread of that post. I'd be interested in reading your reply. Could you send me a link to the IC article, please?

• Schon | Jul 27, 2012, 08:22 AM EDT

  Yo seamomelb, more with the personal insults already... and you an Aussie. the tea was terrible and I couldn't drink it. I must say, the officer's on the most part were well out of the action. The troubles was a small unit action, commonly referred to as a Corporals war. We warred against the terrorists shooting and blowing us up AND against the officers who, in conjunction with the various governments at the time, implemented rules and conditions that made it difficult for the squaddie on the ground to do his job. That's why so many squaddies were killed, because the rules of engagement meant that they had to be under attack before they could engage the enemy... they had to be shot at first before they could return fire.

• Schon | Jul 27, 2012, 08:10 AM EDT

  sirpeter,you and seanomelb, generalise in nearly all of your rantings. Why can't you be more specific and refer to particular events. The Civil Rights marches in the North were initially supported by both communities. Both Protestants and Roman Catholics were disenfranchised in voting in local elections... you had to be a householder/landowner to vote. They could still vote in the Local Stormont and Westminster elections. Problem was republicans refused to take their seats in Stormont. The parades started peacefully, but a group started to take over the organisation with a republican agenda and their militants started to attack police. Becuase of the republican bias then being projected, the Civil Rights lost most of its Protestant support and became more republican. The militants then organised demonstrations and confrontations with police resulting in riots when the marchers attacked the police. The Britsh ARmy weere brought in to support the police and to protect the minority community. Sothe reason the Britsh Army was tere was BECAUSE of the riots during the Civil Rights protests/confroontations.

• seanomelb | Jul 26, 2012, 08:50 PM EDT

  We know why the officer class gave the grunts 'Bromide Tea" every evening after dinner, to stop the hanky panky in the billets after lights out. a great testament to the types who joined the British army.They could not then interrupt the hanky panky in the officers mess a double hanky panky success story.

• sirpeter | Jul 26, 2012, 01:00 PM EDT

  Schon.I labeled you as a soldier which you stated you were and didn't comment on your political views.I was referring to the brainwashing and mentality of your average soldier in a regular army.You say the only thing you see is hate and disinformation.Hate is your emotional reaction to what YOU read and the disinformation is open to question.

• sirpeter | Jul 26, 2012, 12:59 PM EDT

  Schon.I'm Irish living in Ireland by the way.You stated. Quote"You see we weren't sectarian and we enforced the rule of law without bias"Unquote.Your British army upheld the status quo using force and the killing of civil rights marchers whose only wish was to change some injustices of a bigoted NI government using peaceful means.Your British army took the peaceful option and right to protest AWAY from the Irish people by shooting them.Are you proud of that?Was that helping people?Your British army take away the peaceful option that people have to express their wishes and needs and when they have no alternative but to use violent means they are murdering terrorists?What do you suggest people do AFTER they have been shot when using peaceful means???...That's my point.

• kinvara7 | Jul 26, 2012, 12:42 PM EDT

  @Schon: I spotted and replied to your post about 'Ireland's history of national socialism'. You might read it when you find the time. Regards.

• Schon | Jul 26, 2012, 04:57 AM EDT

  If you are American you might have heard of a guy called Washington. He apparently is held in great esteem by your lot. Guess what? He was a soldier. I can relate many instances were your 'grunts' actually were the ones that made the changes while people like you pontificated and sat on their arses and let terrible things happen. And then those murdering terrorists that you both are fond of supporting; they too claim to be soldiers. So what's your point?

• Schon | Jul 26, 2012, 04:53 AM EDT

  (Cont)sirpeter If you are Americans you might have heard of a guy called Washington. He apparently is held in great esteem by your lot. Guess what? He was a soldier. I can relate many instances were your 'grunts' actually were the ones that made the changes while people like you pontificated and sat on their arses and let terrible things happen. And then those murdering terrorists that you both are fond of supporting; they too claim to be soldiers. So what's your point?

• Schon | Jul 26, 2012, 04:51 AM EDT

  Sorry about the duplication but the system doesn't seem to want to have the remainder of my post. Is this the site trying to suppress my reply censorship or what?

• Schon | Jul 26, 2012, 04:48 AM EDT

  sirpeter. The hypocrisy of it all. While not knowing my politics or rationale you attempt to label me in with the Nazis. They were National Socialists a calling your boys in Sinn Fein aspire to. The SS and Wehrmacht were two different organisation both of which had a certain amount of animosity towards each other. I tend to think that 'bastards was a common description they would use to describe each other. Again already, another character attack; you attack my character when you are unable to attack the substance of my arguments.

• Schon | Jul 26, 2012, 04:47 AM EDT

  sirpeter. The hypocrisy of it all. While not knowing my politics or rationale you attempt to label me in with the Nazis. They were National Socialists a calling your boys in Sinn Fein aspire to. The SS and Wehrmacht were two different organisation both of which had a certain amount of animosity towards each other. I tend to think that 'bastards was a common description they would use to describe each other. Again already, another character attack; you attack my character when you are unable to attack the substance of my arguments.

• seanomelb | Jul 26, 2012, 03:23 AM EDT

  schon will now leave the debate a beaten excuse of a man

• sirpeter | Jul 25, 2012, 09:32 PM EDT

  @Schon.You enforced and upheld the repressive bias institutions of NI and Britain.It is understood worldwide that NI was a somewhat mild oppressive statelet.But oppressive none the less.This oppression is the rule of law you upheld.The SS also upheld the rule of law.All salt of the earth types.All from "good" families.That's what the Wehrmacht said.Be it a more extreme oppression.For starters you are a soldier and you are trained and brainwashed to take orders.You are the least qualified to give an objective opinion.You're a grunt.And in general soldiers are lacking the finer arts of a free mind.

• Schon | Jul 25, 2012, 08:15 PM EDT

  My patrols did save a few people by intercepting both loyalist and republican terrorist. You see we weren't sectarian and we enforced the rule of law without bias. So yea, I am proud that I tried to help people. What have you done or are doing? And what direct experience have you of the Troubles other than what you have read and been told? Only thing I can see is that you are spreading hate and disinformation with the bile you serve up on these forums. If you want the facts you can find them on the website cain.ulst.ac.uk. I've no reason to hide my sources. This site serves truthful facts, not the fantasising rants we are accustomed to from you. seanomelb you really have to research and think for yourself. Luv & kisses

• seanomelb | Jul 25, 2012, 07:47 PM EDT

  Indeed Schon your figures compiled by the British are correct in your eyes,maybe you should include the murders committed by your surrogate terrorist mates the UDF,UDA and other organisations which we now know were supported by the BA,the RUC and the B specials. schon the hypocrite keeps pushing his pro British stance. WE must always remember he was a serving tommy killing nationalists in the north and has to justify his miserable existence.

• Schon | Jul 25, 2012, 12:51 PM EDT

  You are correct BigDaddy. Also we have the disgrace of the discriminatory sectarian agency of MacBride and his MacBride Principles made law in the US in 1998 overtly discriminating against the law abiding majority of both communities with the effect of restricting foreign investment in the North, increasing the economic problems of the Province. Then there was the tacit approval of the US DOJ climb down, having first adjudicated that Noraid was to register the Provisional IRA as its "foreign principal" under the US Foreign Agents Registration Act 1938; then, mysteriously being pressured into agreeing to accept a disclaimer which allowed Noraid to continue collecting money by hoodwinking the American public into believing the money raised went to the families of IRA volunteers, when, in fact the US authorities knew the money was used to buy weapons and explosives for the murder and destruction in Northern Ireland and Britain. Senator Ted, Chappaquiddick, Kennedy the hero of republicanism and main fund raiser for Noraid and the IRA. Learn to read and read the facts, Kevin. Don't be like that poor, sad bigot seanomelb.

• Schon | Jul 25, 2012, 10:36 AM EDT

  seanomelb. Again I will say that if the British forces ,consisteing of 25000 British Troops and over 10000 RUC and Reservists at the height of th e troubles, were intent in killing republicans, why, then was only around 360 deaths over 30 years, attributed to the security forces? The vast majority of these deaths were republican and loyalist murderers, 'killed while on active service', as their obituaries stated. Your republican heros murdered over 2060 people. Sean, can I call you Sean? I know that you have a severe problem. What you are suffering from is often referred to as an identity crisis. The only way to treat this is to admit that you are a dissembler of the truth and re-read your history with an open mind. If you tell me who it was that said you were married in a Presbyterian church, I'll have a chat with them and ask them to be more considerate in future taking account of your sensitive and confused nature.

• Schon | Jul 25, 2012, 10:36 AM EDT

  seanomelb, I never suggested that you were married or that it happened in a Presbyterian church, and I'm sorry if people have been saying these things about you. My heart goes out to you. I now understand why you are so confused. Are you still taking the tablets, I wonder? Professionally, I know that they can mess up your memory. But remember, seanomelb, I have made many statements that you have been unable to contradict in my many posts to this forum and that is because I speak the truth.

• BigDaddy | Jul 24, 2012, 11:24 AM EDT

  I never heard of America supporting the I.R.A., where are the facts supporting that nonsense? Kevin, you may want to Google Rep. Peter King and his connections to the IRA. They are numerous. And while the actions of one man may not represent an entire government, don't you have to ask yourself why he was never prosecuted for his connection to an organization the US government viewed to be a terrorist organization?

• seanomelb | Jul 23, 2012, 07:13 PM EDT

  Schon as you reiterated I agree with the right for anyone to march and I was married in the presbyterian church and you call me a hypocrite. I couldn't give at toss about the pope or James or King Billy and you can march 'til shoes fall off. I have no problem with my knowledge of history and there's one thing for sure it's not as narrow as yours. Belphagor I care not who marched but they have the right to do so,you did enough marching in Belfast as a British soldier one wonders whom you harassed some nationalist protesters exercising their right to march.You and Schon come from the same British mold of British apologists. Do not attend the "School of Schon" for his "bit of education" is based on ignorance and deceit.

• NYCsheridan | Jul 23, 2012, 11:43 AM EDT

  As for the other clown, who states "One thing I will say about Irish people in England, they don't consider themselves as Irish British, after a generation they become British, unlike Irish half Americans." We descendants in Armerica consider ourselves American, not Irish. But we are proud of our blood, our heritage, and we more than most, who descended from those the Brits were starving to death, are keenly aware of the difference between an Irishman and an imported imposter. It must rankle you clowns to know that within our lifetimes Catholics will outnumber Protestants in the Six Counties. The ballot box will free Ireland and unify our proud Island Nation once again. Just as Michael Collins intended.

• NYCsheridan | Jul 23, 2012, 11:35 AM EDT

  The problem with Belphagor or Beezlebub or whatever his name is....is really quite simple. He is a Prot, norn i Ireland, who wishes to call himaelf "Irish". But it is the Blood, not the Border, that determines one's makeup. I am an American, but I am an Irish-American. And damned proud of it. The pride, son. It's an Irish trait. Something y would not understand. As for Irish-American Presidents, you left out Reagan, Clinton, and Obama, dumbass.

• YoungPike | Jul 23, 2012, 08:30 AM EDT

  Read EamonnDublin's post and when you've finished, read it again! This is the norm in England; Irish and English living and working side-by-side and EQUAL!

• Schon | Jul 23, 2012, 06:54 AM EDT

  A bit of education here... When we talk of the Irish Catholics, could we please refer to them with their correct title; Roman Catholics. All the proddies are Catholic too, but don't pay allegiance to the Papal institutions. Also, its so nice to see our seanomelb, the bigoted hypocrite, support the right to March, especially when the march is legal. Before you know it he'll be supporting the Loyal Orange Order's legal march celebrating the victory of King William (of Orange) sponsored by Pope Alexander VIII against the deposed James II. But then, what does he know of history. And if we want to talk about fascism, you can start with Irish Fascism and their adherence to National Socialism. (Oh, sorry, more history.) I've no problem with people marching or expressing their own views. What I object to is other people dissembling and/or forcing their views/demands down the throats of others. Unlike you generalists and apologists for murdering terrorists, I don't claim to speak for everyone. I speak for law abiding people who respect the rights of others. I may not agree with the purpose of the Liverpool march, but as long as it has been licensed by the authorities, British athorities I may add, I see no reason that it should be banned. People have a right to voice their opinion too. There used to be a saying... 'Sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never hurt me.' So, what's the problem with some effing & blinding... they are only showing themselves up. Now, when it comes t racist's, aren't these boyo's calling the kettle bla.... not white. Don't you think that the murdering republican terrorists and their apologists, that includes youself, seanomelb, are racist. You consider the Irish a race apart from the English and Scots. So again, you are a hypocite. Luv and kisses.

• Belphagor | Jul 22, 2012, 03:43 PM EDT

  seanmelb you still have misunderstood. You said The Irish Community legally protesting, the Irish Community were not protesting at all. This has nothing to do with the Irish Community, this is a few groups of trouble makers coming into Liverpool to stir up trouble. I witnessed a similar event a few years ago when I took the family to Liverpool to visit the Beatles exhibition. My daughter was only 8 at the time and she witnessed a group of people throwing stones at police, we had to cross the road to get past them in order to reach our car and my daughter was traumatised by the shouting and violence. The whole incident has put her off going to Liverpool again. Thankfully she didn't see the James Larkin republican Flute Band with their paramilitary uniforms and 32CSM placards. The reporter above is using the Irish community to sensationalise the story but it has nothing to do with the irish community. You say I paid lip service to the extreme right, i don't care for the extreme right, if they represent a portion of the poulation then they have a right to peacefully protest but they don't represent me or my views.

• EamonnDublin | Jul 22, 2012, 10:53 AM EDT

  I lived in England for 21 years - from 1958 to 1980, including the latter day "troubles". The single instance of racism encountered by me was when a female teacher from a Catholic school in Leeds told me during a brief motoring altercation to "get back to where I came from". Young pupils of the school told me her name was "Miss O'Flaherty"!! They laughed and said that she is always telling them she is not Irish! I was 15 years old when I went to Leeds - went to school and finished my education there, worked in the British civil service and then in industry. My schoolmates and my workmates, without exception, treated me the same as themselves, and this despite the fact that I always proclaimed my Irishness and my pride in that. We discussed the IRA campaign(s) and English/Irish history, without any rancour. I still go there and visit my English and Irish friends who live there, and vice versa. My reason for posting this? If you go looking for trouble you'll find it quickly enough, even if you try to conceal your intentions with ostensibly "peaceful" cover. Éamonn, Dublin, Ireland.

• citizen69 | Jul 22, 2012, 06:18 AM EDT

  @Belphagor: "I wish seanomelb woud stop with the constant Fascist allegations, do you call everyone who doesn't believe your ideaology names like this?".... Yes he does! He constantly calls me anti-Irish because i don't like the IRA or agree with violent Republicanism, yet he cannot point out one anti-Irish comment i have made.

• Scouse Tony | Jul 21, 2012, 09:40 PM EDT

  I totally agree with Belphagor regarding this article, I was in Liverpool City centre today and if there was some sort of riot or attack on the Irish community going on I didn’t see it. With both my parents having moved to Liverpool from Belfast in the 1950’s if we were an oppressed minority I’m sure we would have noticed. If fact the only time I ever felt oppressed was when my sisters and I had to stop spending our summers at my great aunt’s farm in Armagh because we were “Brit’s”. As far as I can see supporters of Irish republicanism have to be bussed in from other cities and as for Loyalists it’s a couple of days in July and goes from Netherfield Road to Southport and back without much fuss. Apart from the idiots who rock up at Drumcree for a bit of stone throwing and hand wringing about their right to march no one really cares except for Johnnymac12 apparently. As a worker with young offenders I do find it a bit sad that the local BNP has a number of young Catholics with Irish heritage in their ranks but they are more preoccupied with complaining that they can’t get a job because of all the immigrants. My suggestion that they try actually going to the Job Centre was unfortunately drowned out by the sound of their knuckles dragging on the floor.

• seanomelb | Jul 21, 2012, 08:33 PM EDT

  I really couldn't give a fiddlers bow how long you stay on this site. The Irish community legally protesting were targeted by a British Fascist group and all you could say that the Irish group were attacking the citizens of Liverpool and you paid lip service to the extreme right in your original post.I only use "fascist" on those on the extreme right. To paraphrase yourself "you better get use to it"

• Belphagor | Jul 21, 2012, 07:34 PM EDT

  I never said I was English, Iam irish, Born and raised in Belfast but Living in England and most people living in Northern Ireland from the Protestant community are not English either, they are mostly from Ireland and Scotland but there would be a minority from England, the surnames sort of give it away. I wish seanomelb woud stop with the constant Fascist allegations, do you call everyone who doesn't believe your ideaology names like this? I don't support the EDl or NF or whoever else you are talkin about, they are all nut jobs, but so are Cairde na hEireann and Socialist Worker and the James Larkin Society or whatever they want to call themselves. My point still stands, the reporter was misleading in story above and anyone reading it will think that the protesters were there to attack the irsh Community living in Liverpool which is a blatent lie! I can keep coming back and restating my point and you can all carry on calling me names, but Iam here to stay so best get used to me.

• merefalow | Jul 21, 2012, 07:28 PM EDT

  good man Curitiba,the way it is.

• Gearoid4 | Jul 21, 2012, 07:21 PM EDT

  @Belphagor, You contrast the amount of US presidents from a Scots-Irish backgrounds with the single president of Irish-Catholic stock. You mention 11 from Scots-Irish lineage, but the other nationalities/ethnicities mixed in with that, gives the lie to the supposed dominance of the Scots-Irish genes. I think that a little background is needed to your comparison between the presidential fortunes of those constituent parts of the Irish-American diaspora. The Scots-Irish were able to blend seamlessly into the US population because of their protestant, calvinist convictions and thus candidates from that background would not have experienced the overt prejudice that Catholic emigrants and their descendants experienced in the mid-19th century which last well into the 20th century. Historically one has only to recall the virulent anti-Catholic campaign that greeted the Irish-American candidate,Alfred Smith's bid for the White House in 1928. Thus there was a very obvious religio-social and political impediment to any Catholic from stepping forward to be either the GOP or Democratic candidate for the presidency up to 1960 when John Fitzgerald Kennedy overthrew that obstacle to take up residency at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. So it was not through lack of ability that Catholic Irish-Americans did not have as many presidents as the Scots-Irish, but rather due to social and political bigotry.

• aloistmartin | Jul 21, 2012, 06:25 PM EDT

  All Violence and Bloodshed ever got Ireland was Independence form her Protestant Masters! The Irish traded in their Jack Knives and Molotov Cocktails, for Jameson and Kerry Gold, much to soon ! Some say Ireland is weary of The Trouble, but I. say Ireland has " Not Yet Begun To Fight !

• YoungPike | Jul 21, 2012, 09:27 AM EDT

  I'm tired of the endless discourse! Does it really matter if your ancestors were Anglo Saxons, or Celts? Is it better to be Irish than English? Of course not! We are all members of the human race and that's all that really matters!

• Curitiba | Jul 21, 2012, 04:41 AM EDT

  Sorry, Belphagor, and SA Irish, I and most second-generation Irish people I know consider ourselves Irish. I suppose if your parents are Protestants from Belfast of whatever and you are born in England, you could call yourself English, since your entire ancestry is English, but I have no English ancestry at all, so I don't see how I could be any more English than the UK-born Muslims that the EDL seeks to target. However, that is not the same as saying that I am not a good citizen of the UK, which I am. People in the USA do not see a conflict between being ethnically Irish and good US citizens. I have met a few people who totally go against their Irish heritage and bizarrely embrace these extreme English Nationalist ideologies. I would describe these people as self-hating Irishmen, and quite frankly, I feel sorry for them. It makes about as much sense as a person of West Indian heritage joining an extreme nationalist party, on the basis that he was born in the UK and has a Home Counties accent. I wouldn't insult my English friends who can trace their ancestry back many hundreds of years by suggesting that I am as English as them. If I did, it would make a mockery of the word English, by suggesting that it was a kind of lifestyle choice, not a definite nationality with a long history, a characteristic language and distinctive ethnic group, the Anglo Saxons.

• CountyKilburn | Jul 20, 2012, 08:45 PM EDT

  Belphagor, I amused by someone who is not one of us can claim to speak for us. In that case, all descendants of British settlers in Northern Ireland class themselves as Irish, not British. There, I can make sweeping statements too.

• seanomelb | Jul 20, 2012, 08:12 PM EDT

  Belphagor your inability to condemn the fascist right can only lead me to believe you're one of them and your blind acceptance of the OO as a pillar of society (so to speak) only serves to justify my original post.BTW the group must have had permission from the authorities to march so quit the bleeding heart(Swastika) attitude.

• Belphagor | Jul 20, 2012, 07:46 PM EDT

  Second generation Irish Living in England class themselves as English, not British, not Irish. I don't know what CountyKilburn is rabbiting on about.Once again however, those who have commented recently have missed the point. This demo isnt against the Irish Commnity and not even against Irish Nationalism. Those who believe strongly for Irish Nationalism are already living in the 26 counties. The irish community in Liverpool isn't a few blocks of people like little Italy in NY or China Town. Irish Immigrants from Unionist and Nationalit backgrounds have integrated into the whole community and accept the English way of life. The trouble makers that I referred to are not Nationalists, they are die hard Irish Republicans, whilst Sinn Fein are prepared to work with Unionists to find common ground to eventually create everlasting peace, the Republican groups above who are supportive of the 32CSM, call them dissidents or the real IRA or whatever, they are continuing to fight against anyone. PC Ronan Kerr was the last Police man killed in the troubles, he was killed last year by the IRA and he was a Catholic. They are killing their own people, so why would the people of Liverpool be happy to let them parade on their streets? I say again, if the Taliban wanted to hold a parade in Washington DC, you would not be happpy about it. And to sirpeter, regarding the orange order, if they are engaged in anything illegal they shold be banned just like anyone else, I have no agenda, but since signing up to this site I do take exception to the amount of anti-Protestant Bigotry that spews out of many commentators mouths and the lack of any reporter to accurately record the 'other side' of the story means that I am here to stay. 11 of the US Presidents were from Ulster-Scot P,rotestant background and at least 4 others were second generation with only Kennedy from Irish Catholic beginnings yet many Irish Americans have been foole into believing that being irish, they should be Catholic.

• CountyKilburn | Jul 20, 2012, 05:16 PM EDT

  SAIrish - I can't agree with you there. The vast majority of 2nd generation Irish in England consider themselves Irish. We just don't like admitting it to others because we are so tired of the young Irish from the Republic sneering at us for doing so. I have never heard of any 'plastic paddy' changing their surname.

• YoungPike | Jul 20, 2012, 03:56 PM EDT

  SAirish is right; there is no British equivalent of Irish-Americanism. I know of two people born in England to Irish parents who were so ashamed of the IRA terror campaign that they changed their Irish surnames to English ones!

• DanOLoingsigh | Jul 20, 2012, 03:42 PM EDT

  I would lean more to SAIrish, so not sure where Curitiba is coming from...most English I know have a vague idea that they didn't treat Ireland too well...without knowing much of the detail...I think anything to do with Ireland is one of the least likely 'blood boilers', a long way behind Europe, Foreigners in general, eastern Europeans, etc etc...

• SAirish | Jul 20, 2012, 10:55 AM EDT

  I should point out that one of the far right groups is the English Defence League. This is headed by Stephen Lennon, who was born in Luton England of Irish Catholic parents. One thing I will say about Irish people in England, they don't consider themselves as Irish British, after a generation they become British, unlike Irish half Americans.

• SAirish | Jul 20, 2012, 10:07 AM EDT

  I believe that people are getting a bit carried away here. If it really was an IRA march then I can understand the Brits opposing it. There are many St Patrick Day parades and Orange Order parades that pass off quite peacefully in the UK. I don't really think this has anything to do with British blood boiling over Irish nationalism, the man in the street really could'nt care less, Ireland became independent long ago. The Irish born population in the UK stands at over 1 million and is the biggest foreign born group in the UK and the biggest Irish born group in the world outside Ireland. Irish people integrate very well in the UK and there has been an upsurge of Irish people coming to the UK recently. The biggest gripe in the UK is the number of east europeans coming in. There seems to be no resentment about Irish immigrants, it is almost as if Ireland is seen as a part of the UK.

• sirpeter | Jul 20, 2012, 09:34 AM EDT

  @Belphagor.You would consider the Protestant British Orange Order in NI evil people with a nasty agenda as well I presume?Or are you just "Belphegor" the demon from hell who also has an agenda?

• Curitiba | Jul 20, 2012, 09:20 AM EDT

  There is nothing, and I mean nothing, that gets the British blood boiling more than Irish Nationalism. Ireland was the one country that put up the most resistance against British occupation, despite the plantation of colonists, obliteration of the language, suppression of the religion and dispersion of its people around the globe, etc. The British will tolerate mass migration and population replacement in their country, but they will not tolerate Irish nationalism. All other countries they crushed under their heel, but Ireland persistently refused to buckle and that is what rankles with them most. The propaganda war, using such emotive red, white and blue bloodcurdling posters, such as the one illustrated above, is simply a kind of viagra to disguise their complete impotence in subduing the Irish nation and spirit. They can shout slogans against a few powerless immigrants in Liverpool, but they wouldn't dare do the same in Dublin, or indeed Woodlawn, NJ.

• IrelandNorth | Jul 20, 2012, 06:47 AM EDT

  The red hand of Ulster on six pointed (Davidic?) white star emblem is included on the above poster. Does the Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF)/Ulster Defence Association (UDA)/Ulster Freedom Fighters (UFF)/Loyalist Volunteer Force (LVF)/Red Hand Commandos (RHC)/Ulster Resistance (UR)/Third Force (TF) and other such Ulster unionist/loyalist pro-British nationalist Protestant paramilitaries which are supposed to be disbanded support this march. Does the shadow of Sir Oswald Lord Molesley haunt the English politcal landscape still. The operative term in the above poster is, of course, "projection". For how could a peace loving people like the Irish, who suffered wholesale land confiscations and dispossesions down through the centuries that were then given to Anglo-Scotish planter/settlers possibly hate the British. After all, Anglo-Scottish imperialists don't just rape, pillage and plunder any old country. You've got to be pretty special to be worthy of such a dubious privilege. Sadly, the Irish never appreciated such civilising influences, and would complain even if the British hung them with new rope.

• Belphagor | Jul 20, 2012, 04:27 AM EDT

  seanomelb you are so wrong and to call me a racist and fascist is offensive to me. Because i correctly called the protesters, anti british, anti white and anti democracy, check the 'Socialist Worker, James Larkin and Cairde na hEireann' websites if you need clarification, you see that as a reason to call me racist? I am just speaking the truth which the reporter has tried to glaze over, Can't you see the irony, if someone is anti something then they are causing divisions, and are not inclusive. You are trying to shadow my point with your unfounded allegations and character assasination. The organisers and demonstrators of the march are evil people with a nasty agenda, people dont want them on our streets they want to move on. If you have to resort to calling anyone who exposes this rabble as a racist and facist then you are a waste of space.

• Kevin Longan | Jul 20, 2012, 01:38 AM EDT

  Funny how none of you have the cojones to write your own names, hiding behind your vitriol and little pseudonyms. I never heard of America supporting the I.R.A., where are the facts supporting that nonsense? Maybe a very small minority of private citizens (not subjects)support the I.R.A. but that number is negligible. England has a LOT more to worry about than the so-called Irish hordes; open your eyes and see what is up. My English friend once took a plane from the States to Heathrow and he said he was the only "real" Englishman on the entire plane. That's not racist, that's the truth..

• seanomelb | Jul 19, 2012, 10:27 PM EDT

  The organizers may be mostly republican sympathisers,but the message is correct Belphagor is trying to hide his racism under a thin cloak of civility. James Larkin fought for the conditions you and your racist friends enjoy today you fascist.

• Belphagor | Jul 19, 2012, 06:53 PM EDT

  The above report is inaccurate on so many levels, it's a shame that Hilda Higgins didn't do any research before writing this. Firstly the ' Irish Parade' that was organised by Cairde na hEireannin February wasn't the typical St Patricks style celebration of the finer parts of the irish Culture nor was it a community event. The organisers are out and out IRA supporters, they use Irish Republican flute bands who openly wear paramilitary style clothing, carry IRA Flags and chant IRA slogans at the police and passers by. The good people of Liverpool are sick and tired of this rhetoric and 'stuck in the past' mentality and didn't want them on their streets. Together with local community groups, ex soldiers, politicians, clergymen and the police, they stopped them from having their sectarian hate filled march. If you can imagine a group of Al Quaeda Supporters wanting to hold a parade in Washington DC you will understand how the people of Liverpool feel about a PRO IRA parade in their community. Most of those who actually managed to reach the proposed starting point of the parade were bussed in from Scotland, Manchester and Birmingham, hardly a community event. The march orgainsed for this Saturday to commemorate James Larkin, a trade union man but also a Communist who was expelled from the Socialist Party in America for his links with Bolsheviks in the Soviet Union. He was later jailed for his part in the disruption of munitions to allied troops, a crime of treason that should have resulted in the death penaly back then. Although Organised by Socialist Workers Movement as an anti fascist and anti racist event, many of the same faces, wearing different hats will be organising it and attending it. The same people who are anti-white, anti-British and anti-democracy....what a joke.

• seanomelb | Jul 19, 2012, 05:41 PM EDT

  Lokionline and johnnymac are ingrates with pea brains and soft heads

• TayandCake | Jul 19, 2012, 05:37 PM EDT

  You're not wrong there Dev4

• merefalow | Jul 19, 2012, 04:26 PM EDT

  no surrender, you've already lost you pathetic outspan.you just dont know it yet.there are race laws now to curb the rantings of you little Nazis.so rant futiley on

• tony2phones | Jul 19, 2012, 02:38 PM EDT

  It is 7 days since the Liverpool Orange orders marched in Southport just as they do Every Year. Talk about one rule for one and one rule for another

• dev4 | Jul 19, 2012, 01:35 PM EDT

  i say leave england to the muslims.get the hell out

• lokionline | Jul 19, 2012, 11:43 AM EDT

  I love your post johnnymac12. That's the spirit... "Naiii Sirrennnder"
  
  I have always enjoyed the sound of the true blood loyalist Brit bellowing out that line. Sounds even better when backed up by a nice big drum!
  
  I hope you had a nice shower and good stiff drink after that emotional contribution. Feels good doesn't it?
  
  What's even more entertaining is the fact that I know you came back to see what kind of response your love note generated.
  
  Personally, I want to see more of your work. You just earned yourself a fan. Have a great day!

• shuvonn | Jul 19, 2012, 11:40 AM EDT

  what a hateful biased racist rant you spewed up all over this message board, johnnymac. You do NOT represent anyone with your hateful words.

• YoungPike | Jul 19, 2012, 10:30 AM EDT

  There are some very nasty right-wing thugs in England, and their numbers seem to be on the rise, apparently fueled by widespread concern over mass immigration. But by and large the Irish community in Britain have assimilated remarkably well and are accepted by the majority of the British. I think the far-right groups are opportunists and will use smear tactics to swell their numbers. They mustn't be allowed to demonize an established section of the community for their perverse ideology and all decent Irish and English people should stand shoulder-to-shoulder against them.

• johnnymac12 | Jul 19, 2012, 10:24 AM EDT

  The 'parade' in Liverpool is NOT aimed against the Irish community in Liverpool. It is against the organisers of the parade who are supporters of the murdering B******S of the ira, who are responsible for the murders of thousands of innocent women, children and unborn babies, shoot in the back murders of the legal security forces in what is and always be a part of the U.K. They should not be allowed to walk on any part of British soil, and I along with the majority of Loyalist British totally condemn the support these despicable imbeciles get year after year, month after month and week after week from our so called best ally, America. It was different when the atrocities happened in America, you got the full backing from the British Government and the Government of Northern Ireland. It is a pity that loyalty was not returned. I do not expect to get any support from this site as it is clearly pro ira and anti British. NO SURRENDER...FAUGH A BALLAGH.