Famed atheist professor says 'being raised Catholic is worse than child abuse’

Misneac! get a hold of yourself,on second thoughts that ay be the problem.

Perhaps Dawkins would enlighten us on the glory of Sharia law ! It might explain the philosophies of the "after life " ,also why I always thought that natural marriage is between male and female .Oh I feel such guilt ,must be my Catholic upbringing !

No such thing as Anglo-Norman. They have faded into history.

You are lost in your own mythological thoughts Gearoid

Again another over-reaction by overly-emotional posters on here.

@Eiriamach, When you refer to "equal participation" are you talking about the 2000 year old practice of the Catholic Church not extending the priesthood to women? The Catholic view on gender in relation to priesthood is not based on sociological trends or opinion polls, but rather on the decision of the Savior Himself to appoint only men to the first 12 positions of His apostolate. The priesthood moreover is based on the Personhood of Christ and thus being male is not incidental to the choice of candidates for this vocation. It is also based on the Judaic priesthood of the O.T. which came to it's perfection in the Person of Jesus Christ. Men and women have different roles in the Church which are equal but different. "Benedict's cult" as you so disparagingly call it, was promised by the Lord that the Holy Spirit will be present with Her(the Church) during His absence and that guarantee still remains. The Catholic Faith when properly presented is reasonable and enriching and will lead people to the Truth and not the subjective worldly versions that one wants to superimpose on Christian tenets.

I remember the line my friend gave when we visited New Orleans and were met by Hare Krishnas. "What God are you peddling today?" I have thought about that even after becoming a Catholic. He was right religion is just a way of life with these horrific after life consequences. I think the Southern Baptists think like the Catholics too. So it is really a religious thing that you can believe or not. Personally I like Christ and God but not the way religion portrays them, expecially the catholics and their interpretations. Catholics my Mom is not in Hell becasue she wanted to save her life, but she lived the abuse of the Catholic religion her whole life and it affected her termendously. I am no longer a Catholic as I can not condone a seller of God who would do this to any one.

I remember the irrational fears that catholic teachings caused me and children I knew growing up. Dawkins is absolutely correct on this.

@Gearoid4, once a week at that high school, we had a Latin Mass, with nuns serving at the altar. Today, by Vatican decree to placate uber-conservatives like you, no female may approach the altar to serve a traditional Mass. Is that progress? Jesus would sharply reply to anyone who suggested that "Domine non sum dignus" means "I am not worthy *because* I am a woman." No woman with a shred of integrity can support a Church that rejects the equal participation of women and pretends that churchmen have divine authority to deprive women of equal service to God and equal moral autonomy in life. What "intrinsic truth" do they protect when priests must read from the pulpit bishops' letters directing the laity to vote against equal rights? What "hurricane" do they fear the equality of women or gays represents? They've shut the window and sealed it, rolled back Vatican II reforms, and with solitary hubris, the pope walks upon turbulent waters rather than helping to keep the fishing boat of the Christian churches afloat in a storm. The fishing boat will make its way to safe harbor for repairs (0ongoing reform), while Benedict's cult will sink beneath the waves. Dawkins ironically serves the faith he rejects when he calls attention to the harm that abuses of Christian ethics cause to children, especially, I'd add, to girls.

Stupid Anglo fails to realise he referred to English catholics not just Irish Catholics.How oneeyed can poor old Anglo get.

Anglo-norman, you are an obvious bigot; continuosly spouting anti Catholic and anti Irish views. You should be ashamed of your background (if it is anglo norman). Colonisers and bigots all the way throughout history. Probably Northern Ireland prod I would think. Look up w.a.s.p. if you have the brains to do so. Nothing to be proud of there. Your prod majority in N. Ire will soon be a thing of the past and about time. You can always join the remnants of your clan in S. Africa or the red necks in Appalachia; and bring your Lambeg drum with you.

Still more parodying of Catholic beliefs, Eiriamach. The "hell and fire" sermons are a thing of the past and it is hardly the stuff of the timid and vapid sermons that you will hear from a lot of pulpits nowadays. Many priests do not touch on the "red-button" issues such as abortion and same-sex "marriage" and prefer to give a feel-good talk instead. You complain about the "open-window" being shut, but open windows should be open to let in healthy fresh air, but not hurricanes which sweep all before them in terms of intrinsic truths, which progressive, modernist activists want to overturn.

If only the abuse-- being lashed about by didactic 'hellfire and damnation' RC churchmen-- ended with childhood! but it's fiercer than ever. See the article on the pope's anti-same-sex-marriage speech for examples. I often think ironically of a sweet old librarian nun who helped me work through a section of the Summa Theologica when I was in high school and I couldn't agree with RC teaching on a point of moral philosophy. I still disagreed after we read Aquinas. She didn't lecture me (though she was learned in theology) or chastise me for not accepting the teaching. She smiled and said, "Don't worry! You're only in high school now, but when you get to university, you'll be able to debate all these questions, they're all open to challenge, even Aquinas, and you'll find your own answers." That "open window" in RC has been shut, nailed closed, and concreted over with warnings posted, and I'm glad the cheerful old nun did not live to see it happen.

Yet Irish Catholics are still too blind or dumb to see through this charade.

Someone need to sell a few oul newspapers! He made the observation years ago. He's right though. In Ireland overall the mental abuse perpetuated by the Vatican's sick cult is even greater than the physical abuse and facilitates that abuse in turn. It was the brainwashed Vatican followers in the Irish government who let the church get away with it right up to the present day. Teaching children that some interstellar zombie got himself nailed to two planks on their behalf is sick.

There were also good things about my education in an all-girls Catholic School. We even had fun. And we learned to think - which is why, I believe, the RC church produces all the best atheists and agnostics. We also developed a social conscience, which is in too short supply, IMHO.

He's a publicity hound, becoming a caricature of himself. Although the Catholicism I grew up in was kind hearted and open minded ("Make up your own mind on that one"), I have since learned many were actually brought up in a fear-ridden, neurotic Catholicism. But not to the point of abuse.

I grew up in the certain knowledge that my parents were going to hell. My father had divorced his first wife, whom he had married in the church, and his marriage to my mother was not considered a marriage in the Roman Catholic Church. Every day they lived together was a mortal sin, and there was no remedy for it. Nor did either of them take the situation nearly as seriously as I thought they should. After all, THEY were the ones going to hell. They never went to mass and my dad was an atheist, and my mother had Fallen Away and they cheerfully paid for me to go to a convent school at which, along with excellent Penmanship, Geography, Perennial Guilt, Drama, and English, I was steeped in the Terror of Theology. I can't say that it has affected me in the long term, because by age 13, I was shut of the whole RC concept. But my talent for theological argument had been honed and sharpened in the best possible atmosphere, and when I realized the basic Evil of organized religion, and decided to oppose organized religion all my life, I can say I was truly grateful for my Catholic Education.................

Regarding the fears that the catholic church inflicts on many I totally agree! It's mind boggling how few have addressed this issue. Mr. Dawkings is to be commended for his views and I for one took years to overcome the incredible anxiety the church inflicted upon me with no chance of, as a child, to comprehend yet dread. One further mention is what the church is now doing to children who are gay. Suicide, in my opinion, is directly related. Brian J.Mack

I agree with Ken from Dublin. Need to put this topic in context, though, this is just typical Irish Central Catholic baiting. They love this stuff at IC. After this one there will be another abortion article (IC just loves the whole abortion idea) and they will try some tortured way to wedge in the word Savita into their pro-abortion rhetoric. Anti Catholic, pro-abortion Irish Central can always be relied on for these opinion based stories. Look for no facts here or balanced views.

I totally agree with Dawkins. We are suffering from the frog in warm water syndrome, we do not realise Catholicism has boiled us alive. Catholicism in it's very essence is emotional and psychological abuse branching out into sexual abuse with specific and substantial evidence...but it's too painful to face for many, we would prefer to continue to believe the bullshit.

“…We all may have particular beliefs and perspectives about the causes, contexts, nature, and scope of clergy sexual abuse in the Catholic Church, but we should be informed by empirical data, logic and reason rather than emotion” (Lynch, 2009). "Religion can be a very strong contributor to a person's sense of emotional well-being. There are many aspects of faith and religions practice that an fill all the basic human needs, if a person is open to it” (Plante, 2011). Lynch, P., & Munschauer, C. A. (2009). Religion as a Path to Emotional Well-Being. Human Development, 30(4), 39-44. Plante, T. G. (2011). Why Are So Many So Misinformed. Human Development, 32(2), 27-29.

"If we abstract from the eternity of its punishment, the existence of hell can be demonstrated even by the light of mere reason. In His sanctity and justice as well as in His wisdom, God must avenge the violation of the moral order in such wise as to preserve, at least in general, some proportion between the gravity of sin and the severity of punishment" (NewAdvent[dot]org, Catholic Encyclopedia, Keyword: Hell).

Ireland would be better off if someone took all the Moderates, and Atheists, and Unionists, and put them on a long slow boat for Saudi Arabia !

Roseanne Barr said the same thing. g

Seanomelb at 05.55 is slightly correct… Heel (misspelling deliberate), as portrayed in hundreds of art paintings (burning fire and agony forever) doesn’t exist. But it’s reality does exist in another way. Everyone one of us, sinners all, gets to see G*d only once (on the so-called Judgement Day). The sight of the glory of G*d is said, by some saints, to be so glorious that you’d want (forget refreshing swimming pools and showers) to wallow in it forever. I don’t know what the Glory of God is… it’s something that none but those souls blessed by God have been exposed to it have privilege to, probably much as Lucia, of Fatima fame, was exposed to the sight of souls in Hlle (mispeeling again deliberate). Unrepentant non-believers will see the glory of God once and will not see that glory anymore, forever, for eternity. The pain of that loss is equated, in human terms, to the pain of dying by fire forever - and no one of us wants that. We all have to make the choice. The glory of God exists in eternity. As human beings, we won’t exist in eternity but the soul within us all will. We are all free to choose for our souls.

Why would u give an idgit like Dawkins any air time. He can stay in his cubby hole with nall the other oxford idgets!He has no hope! Lets make radical comparisons to justify ignorance? They wont be hiring you to buils a cathedral Dawkins , sorry you are not qualified!

AS an atheist schooled in the Catholic system I can see Dawkins point. Priests Frightening children into accepting God by terror using hell stories or the sword of Democles hanging by a thread over you and other scare methods is certainly child abuse. I watched a debate between RD and Cardinal pell(archbishop of Sydney) In which PEll after many protestations finally admittted that hell did not exist.

Ah! I see Richard Dawkins is doing himself more harm than good. That’s called self-abuse, isn’t it? Is that worse than child-abuse? Perhaps RD could enlighten us with the magnanimity of his selfish brain's thoughts? In October 2006, he had a great debate about his latest money-chasing effort on his book, ‘The G*d Delusion’, with a fellow from Ireland called David Quinn. ‘Google’ or ‘Bing’ to listen to the debate (runs for about 18 minutes, crack open a beer or pour yourself a glass of wine and sit back to hear a fascinating heated discussion) or you can read a transcript of the debate if you’re deaf. At the time, Mr. Dawkins was in Dublin, Ireland, to promote his latest book and was signing copies of it in a bookstore in the afternoon after the morning radio debate. A customer said to him “You got a beating off David Quinn this morning, eh?” To which Dawkins basically tiredly replied “Yes, I did”, for once saying something true. Dawkins later posted, on his own website, words to the effect that he had won the debate, which everybody who listens to the debate knows he didn’t. He’s a self-delusional liar, out and out. Don’t fall for buying his books or self-promotional efforts to extract money from your pockets to line his own pockets with it.

The philosophy trade needs controversial people like Dawkins selling his books. People who read his writings and become curious about the issues tend to read other philosophers, and eventually they can think critically for themselves. Dawkins has stimulated gazillions of brain cells that FOX News would have put permanently out of use. I don''t ever agree with him, but I'm glad he's doing the thing he does.

Please forgive my grammatical errors; I am posting in a library, and a part of this comment screen is obstructed.

I think this man is crazy! First of all, Nobody ever told me, as a child, that non Catholics were going to Hell. If that's the way they believed, and lead good lives, the Lord would accept them. What bothers me is the dogmatic teachings on human sexuality, which I have gone over numerous times before here. That type of guilt is unhealthy and counterproductive towards a healthy outlook towards the opposite sex. Incidentally, I just came from Confession. Although the priest maintained that the Church, being around for 2,000 years, had a proper outlook on this manner, he respected my position. I insisted that one should always consider his/her partner's wishes, and not treat her like a "piece of meat, or him like a means to gold dig. He said what he believed, I said what I believed, and for my other transgressions, was given a penance of 1 Hail Mary. Mat we all, men & women and priests and laity, all treat each other with respect!

As an atheist I find Dawkins remarks incendiary and vitriolic. Unhelpful is just too light a rating. Using the comparsion is just to stir up emotions and anger rahter than to provide solid critisism. If you seperate the two items it is better. Growing up abused is an aweful fate especially when it is at the hands of those in any position of trust. The degree of damage due to growing up catholic (or any other religion) is widely varied. Those who grew up believing in Santa suffered much less damage though.

The worriest form of child abuse is medication. Growing up in Catholic, and Public Schools. Paddling was done regularly. But no one was drugged. When boys acted up, they were paddled. Today they are drugged. Taking away someone conscience though is abuse.

Oh I don't know, I myself was raised a Katlik and am still a practicing Katlik. Except for the self-inflicted gunshot wounds, I am fairly normal except for that persistent erection that lasts for more than 4 hours.

I was raised Catholic, attending Catholic schools etc and no one told me what this fool reports. Maybe his parents told him that. Nothing worse then child abuse by priests, ministers, boy scouts, doctors or any authority figure especially parents.Do you only read IC and not any other news source ? Abuse is committed by lots of different people from different backgrouns.

Typically IC publicizes the sensational and headline-grabbing rantings of a celebrity atheist who ridiculously states that being raised Catholic is worse than undergoing sexual abuse. Dawkins seems to have lost the run of himself here with this appalling assertion and has stepped away outside the bounds of his competency. Sexual abuse of a child is nothing less than the destruction of his/her innocence while being raised Catholic offers a cohesive and positive religious experience which leads to children growing up as well-balanced young adults, if done in a positive fashion.

Dawkins is one of the few intellectuals brave enough to stand up to religious nonsense. I agree with him fully. He is one of the most articulate and empirical scientists of our century. He is looking for attention, true, but for the reason of showing the world how ridiculous these belief systems are, and how much harm they truly cause. You should be thankful for his tireless efforts.

I am sure sexual abuse is way more traumatizing to people than being raised Catholic. I was raised Catholic and am a total non-believer (I don't use the word "Atheist") and was also sexually abused when I was young, and that traumatized me way more than being raised Catholic.

Oh, the irony . . . the interview was on Al Jazzeera. Of course a fundamentalist Islamist upbringing in suicide bomber academies (aka madrases) is a much more wholesome environment for raising children

Not quite sure why Dawkins is making a distinction. Catholic Priests have tried to combine the two propositions for years.

OMG... this man is totally mentally dead!!! Don't put any guns in his hands. I wouldn't be surprised if he isn't one of the molesters and wants to blame it on something! What a total idiot!!

I feel sorry for Richard Dawkins and those like him.They have nothing to look forward to.If there is nothing after this life Iwont be disappointed as I will not know there was nothing,BUT,if there is something then what Richard?

That Dawkins guy is some clown ! Having to listen to him would be abuse enough for anybody !

Yes, again Richard Dawkins can't seem to recognise that it is possible to have sincere spiritual practitioners (in any faith) - the terrible abuses are because so many people are cruel, hateful and not in control of their mind and senses. Jesus said love God and love your neighbour, so don't blame God, Jesus, etc if people are deviating. But he does this all the time. Richard Dawkins is someone who thinks the universe started with an explosion without an intelligent force. Yet, in all our experience explosions destroy things; they do the opposite of creating things. So you need to have some blind faith to believe in that one! Hare Krishna! (That all said, the abuses are a disgrace. My wife and I saw two films about abuses in Irish schools / institutions this year, and those weirdos are due for some serious bad karma)