53-year old Irish carpenter re-emigrates to New York, describes why he had to leave

Gaelic ancestry is pretty much the same as being white. Its nothing special or rare infairness.

People born in Ireland are irish, people born in England are English with common 'gaelic' ancestry. I am Irish, you are English!

Then what is the point of Ireland if you (we) are all basically British!

Curitiba, I said the situation in NI is an anomaly. People can get both Irish and British passports thanks to the Good Friday agreement. Passports are given to people with Irish grandparents for the same reason those certs of Irishness or whatever they are, for money! My brother will register them as kiwis. We have had this conversation when he was home at Christmas. If theyre born in England then they are English with an irish dad. If they are born in Ireland then they are Irish with an English mother! DNA tests prove that our DNA is not different whether we are from Scotland, Ireland, England or wherever. The difference is where we are born and raised.

Phew, I think I'll go and lie down now. Like that one about the Turkish, Gaelphoncan. It's the exact opposite of the situation we are dealing with!

People born in NI who claim they are British are NOT an anomaly. They are as an integral part of Ireland as you are, Ciara, and their interpretation of their culture is just as valid as yours. The Republic of Ireland is every bit an artificial concept as NI, and indeed every other nation on Earth. One week you're French, one quick war later, and then your German, as the border is moved. Eye rolling won't suppress truth. My eyes roll as well every time I hear the same tired, poorly argued proclaiments that ethnic Irish people don't exist. There you go, that's something we have in common! I suppose according to your reasoning, a person born to Irish parents on a plane crossing the Atlantic, would be the Man from Atlantis, would they? The patch of dirt where you are born is irrelevant. It's your ancestry that matters. Tell you what, Ciara, should your brother decide to register his kids as Irish citizens, will you be writing to your TD to prevent this affront to right-thinking Irish people such as yourself. Don't want any more of those dreadful Plastic Paddies polluting our pure definition of Irish, do we? The very fact that Irish citizenship, every bit as equal to yours, exists for all people of Irish descent (up to grandparents, I think) blows your arguments completely out of the water.

Gael, we dont hate you! I have American cousins! I adore them! My aunt is Irish but her kids are Americans! Deal with it! People not integrating is the cause of many issues in the world today. You move to another country, its up to you to integrate or even assimilate with the host country Just get on with it!

What is it with you lot and feeling the need to label yourselves as irish? I dont live in Britain so I dont pretend to know the British psyche so why do you think you understand ours? The ethnic Irish are the travellers. Gaelic people are in Scotland, Ireland, Wales, England, Jersey, Isle of man etc. We are the same ethnicity. Those who live in Ireland are Irish therefore you arent! We arent hostile to you, we are indifferent! Tell an Irish person youre irish and watch the eyes roll! We have heard it all for our entire lives. We have nothing in common! As for my'tribal homeland' seriously man, get a grip! I have many British friends. I couldnt care less where their parents are from. we are mates because we have common interests not becaue their granny is Irish. Gael, your issue with the dole is due to the habitual residency act to ensure there is no welfare tourism to Ireland. Everyone is treated the same regardless. As you know due to the Good Friday agreement, the North IS an anomaly. So no point in comparing that to your situation. If my bro has kids with his girlfriend in NZ, the kids will be kiwis with an Irish dad and an English mam. Not Irish and not English.

You're right, Curitiba. I think it's somehow connected to our history of being a colonised people and the insecurity resulting from that. I was talking to a Turkish friend a couple days ago about the Turkish diaspora and he said that some Turkish who emigrate choose to try to assimilate and abandon their Turkish roots but that the Turkish in Turkey make great efforts to convince them not to leave the fold or turn their backs on their roots. "We try to convince them that they still belong to us, that they're still Turkish" were his words, if I remember correctly. I laughed when he said that and than thought of Ciara and of the IBABs who think like her and felt sad. Whether Ciara and those who think like her admit it or even understand it, for the Irish in Ireland to denigrate or despise the Irish diaspora is a form of self-hatred (and I think the self-hatred of the Irish has something to do with our colonial history). It's the wee hours of the morning in the part of the world where I live so I'd better call it a night.

Thanks for your endorsement, Gaelphoncan. Your posts bring much-needed clarity to this debate.

This whole Irish identity debate is something worthy of acedemic research in itself, Gaelphoncan. Or a television series, investigating the various manifestations of Irish identity, and the cause of the resentment of Irish-born people towards ethnic Irish people retaining their irish identity and contrasting this with the warmth and encouragement that other nations show towards their diasporas. Judging by the amount of second and third-generation Irish out there, I am very surprised that no-one has investigated this before. Ethnic irish people in Britain are very aware of the hostility towards their asserting of their Irish identity, whereas Irish Americans are not as aware of this, I think.

Just for the record, I can speak German, Spanish, French, Portuguese, and enough Italian to get by when I was on holiday in Sicily a few years ago, as well as the 2 languages I speak best, the 2 (official) languages of my tribal homeland, namely, Irish and English. At the moment, I'm learning Mandarin and finding it harder than any European language I've ever learnt (and I suppose I'm finding it harder to learn languages as I get older). I'm on the other side of the world and feel so homesick for Ireland (and of course, I miss my wife. She's in Ireland working hard and keeping the home fires burning) Barry McKinley does strike me as a sort of Dónall Mac Amhlaigh type character, a builder with a nice turn of phrase (I liked 'iPaddies' and the comment about firing up the particle accelerator at Stanford). I wish him all the best in Amerikay and hope he gets on well there in whatever he turns his hand to. “I don't expect you to understand the Irish psyche” - that is so arrogantly patronising, Ciara. Curitiba has an understanding of the Irish emigrant's psyche (which is a part of the Irish experience) that you in all likelihood will never have (mostly because you're willfully close-minded). I suppose you consider yourself an expert on Irishness and have appointed yourself to speak on behalf of ALL of the Irish born and bred in Ireland. For flip's sake, cop on, Ciara.

Fair play to you, Curitiba, you express the perspective of the children of the Irish diaspora in such an articulately passionate manner. You and I were brought up in countries thousand of miles apart yet we recognise each other as fellow tribal members. Sadly, some of those members of our tribe, whose parents or grandparents were never compelled by circumstances to leave the tribal homeland, totally reject our tribal affiliation. I returned to Ireland in 2009 after living on the Continent for a few years (doing research on a subject similar to that of my PhD). When I returned, I married a lovely cailín Gaelach and had every intention of settling down and staying in Ireland for good. I was well qualified and had relevant experience working abroad and I don't think I was necessarily naively optimistic that I would find some kind of gainful employment in my field. Well, it wasn't the way things worked out. I was one of the 70,000 who left Ireland last year and for me it was out of pure necessity and not out of choice. Nobody put a gun to my head, Ciara, but I decided to be proactive and do something before the debts piled up too high. Financial circumstances forced me to leave agus sin bun agus barr an scéil. I stuck it out for over 2 years and applied for (literally) hundreds of jobs. “I am sure that most of the 70,000 who left Ireland last year did so not because they fancied a big adventure, but because they would sit and rot on the dole otherwise” In my case, Curitiba, I wasn't even eligible for the dole (because I had been working outside of Ireland – there are more than a few people in this situation in Ireland).

By the way, Ciara, I am very interested in what goes on in the UK too, I comment on UK news websites as well. I can debate the upcoming petrol tanker strike with you if you want!

Ciara, you are no more or no less Irish than I am. I post on here because I am interested in the worldwide Irish community. I don't think any patch of land has pre-eminence over any other as far as being Irish is concerned. I think you post here to deny the existence of the irish community in America, which is a dreadfully cynical thing to do. This "i'm more irish than you" sniping is very divisive and antagonistic. Why can't we just be Irish people and leave it at that? Is a Unionist politician more irish than me? He might be born in ireland, and have ancestors there for hundreds of years, but he still isn't Irish. You say that is an anomaly. What, 800,000 people are an anomaly? Come on, if you are going to go down that road, then you could say that Irish people in the North of ireland are an anomaly from the point of view of the Unionists, and I could claim that the millions of people in the UK of irish descent is an anomaly as well, so they could claim to be Irish on that basis. But I am saying that we are all Irish, because of our shared heritage. As for the Irish language, well it's not much use to anyone unless a person from Louth can go into a shop in Kerry and and complete a transaction, is it. As it is totally dialect-ridden,and considered eccentric to address a stranger in Irish outside of the Gaeltacht, it's not really any good as a universal medium of communication for everyday social and business use. I would love to learn it, but what is the point if nobody understands because I have learned one of the Mayo dialects and nobody in Dublin understands, and vice-versa. Worse than a trip to Glasgow.